Developers and DBAs

  • Comments posted here are about the content posted at temp

  • Sounds like it was a bad match all the way around... it was a good thing that you bailed.  How ya doin' now?

    --Jeff Moden


    RBAR is pronounced "ree-bar" and is a "Modenism" for Row-By-Agonizing-Row.
    First step towards the paradigm shift of writing Set Based code:
    ________Stop thinking about what you want to do to a ROW... think, instead, of what you want to do to a COLUMN.
    "Change is inevitable... change for the better is not".

    Helpful Links:
    How to post code problems
    How to Post Performance Problems
    Create a Tally Function (fnTally)
    Intro to Tally Tables and Functions

  • hi Janet,

    the atmosphere was just the same at my office, I am a DBA but have no power to educate the developers to use a better query syntax since they were my senior *sigh* and I admit that my skill was average too maybe this is the reason they underestimated me, but I told myself that I have to face all these barriers and prove them my existance. Definitely I support you...do your best !

    > blue <

  • Fortunately i've not been in that position, but if I ever find myself there they wont see me for dust.

    I'm a professional, and I expect to work with professionals.  I appreciate that sometimes office politics come into play but I try not to get involved.

    The company where I work now values the input of everyone, and because i'm someone that gets results and is willing to go the extra mile I know that my opinions carry a lot of weight.

    I feel sorry for anyone caught in the situation that you described, how on earth does a company expect to be profitable in the long term if it treats employees so dismally? In the end everyone will just vote with their feet.

    I hope that you've found somewhere decent to work now

  • I'm a contractor and have come against this sort of situation. The way I deal with it, is that I offer the benefit of my experience, and if they take it fine, if they don't that's their choice (they have to live with once I'm gone).

    Interesting article. Hope you've got good work now.

  • It works all ways around, there are Managers, Developers, DBAs, Directors etc. all of whom may be "challenged" in one way or another.

    If you care about your work it's sometimes easier to become a contractor rather than beat yourself up over it, easier said then done I know, at least you can walk away. I'm working on a similar view to Karl, although there's a fine line between incompetence and idiocy and it seems to be alive and well in many companies!!

    I'm a production DBA btw. Nice article of the other kind, my sympathies, don't get disheartened get tougher!!

    [font="Comic Sans MS"]The GrumpyOldDBA[/font]
    www.grumpyolddba.co.uk
    http://sqlblogcasts.com/blogs/grumpyolddba/

  • About all one can ever do is to offer their best professional recommendations and go from there.  It is management's choice to employ that advice or ignore it.   It helps to document the who, what ,when, where, why, and how of those situations, just in case that information is ever needed. 

    Asking better questions during an interview (non-threatening, of course) on how things are done, by whom (every organization has added their own tweaks to the standard project lifecycle), etc. can give insights into what to expect after joining an organization and help level one's expectations.

    Hope things are better at your current location.

  • Seen it .... been there ..... done that .... burned out ..... revived ... bailed out ...

    Now I'm having a job that's giving me the occasion to develop my skills and allows me to - every once in a while - build a more optimal system, proc, ... and where I say what are my concerns regarding as well developers as dba-related mid-term or long-term sideeffects of the decisions to be taken.

    Because business is 24/7 they tend to think only NOW and my job is more like 911 firefighting, cpr for data and databases. If I no longer can live with that I know I have to bail out.

    What I also try to do is to build in some relief time in my professional activities. Quality time gets my nerves at a reasonable level and keeping sunshine in my life and those I care for.

    Also keep in mind tons of books and theories regarding IT have been published and invested in, for most of the companies to be ignored

    That's why there are consultants. Their advise has a better chance of being accepted, let's hope not only because their time is expressed in $$$$

    Johan

    Learn to play, play to learn !

    Dont drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ...
    but keeping both feet on the ground wont get you anywhere :w00t:

    - How to post Performance Problems
    - How to post data/code to get the best help[/url]

    - How to prevent a sore throat after hours of presenting ppt

    press F1 for solution, press shift+F1 for urgent solution 😀

    Need a bit of Powershell? How about this

    Who am I ? Sometimes this is me but most of the time this is me

  • Hello,

    In my opinion this war isn't about Developers against DBAs, it's about People against People.

    There is a simple solution in this case: Be Professional, no matter what's your job role.

    There is a famous phrase that I like very much and can be used in this case: "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us".

    Follow my 3D rules: Direction, Discipline and Determination.

    and make your choice:

    a) No matter what you do (Benny Benassi)

    b) Just Do it (Nike)

    c) Think Different (Albert Einstein)

    Best,

    Alex Rosa

    MCTS SQL Server 2005

    MCDBA SQL Server 2000

    Brazil

    ---------------------
    Alex Rosa
    http://www.keep-learning.com/blog

  • never see it as a war - that indicates conflict which is a negative. However, that said I have a xmas mailing list to recieve  The Muppets Wizard of Oz dvd ( aplogies if the references are obscure or don't translate well !! )

    I give an excellent example :- Company builds new servers with C: drive = 10Gb, D: drive = 2GB ( all on primary drive ) remainder of disk unallocated. Page file sits on C: drive. Server with 4Gb ram, sql2005 install ( binaries on C: drive ) almost entire C: drive full - alerts raised as under 25% free space. 60Gb unallocted space on primary drive ( or 24 depending on 36 / 72 )

    I suggest we increase C: and D: drive to 50% each of disk space, maybe put binaries on D: and keep page file on C: ( isn't actually what I prefer but hey not my issue )

    Answer from "Management"  - "nice idea , but, doesn't fit with company build standard"  - what can you do ?

    [font="Comic Sans MS"]The GrumpyOldDBA[/font]
    www.grumpyolddba.co.uk
    http://sqlblogcasts.com/blogs/grumpyolddba/

  • hi colin - wonder which company that was??? sounds like the one we've both contracted at ???

    MVDBA

  • In your situation, it sounds to me like management really meant, "that sounds like a great idea, but I have no idea what you are talking about".  It are those situations that are really frustrating, when you have a sound solution to a problem, you pitch the solution, but have to pitch it to someone who really doesn't know what they are doing.

  • everyone knows that all developers are evil

    I think it's more of the same MS battle beween the GUI and the command prompt/scripting. Back in my MS Exchange/AD days I knew the GUI and didn't know too much about the guts of the system which is a mystery to most people anyway.

    When I started with SQL almost a year ago I told myself I'm going to be a scripting guy. I still use the GUI for some easy tasks, and too much I think. Most things I'm learning to write my own SQL code to do.

    I think that too many people who work with MS software never get past the GUI and because of this don't learn enough about the product. And every new release MS encourages this with new wizards and whatever to make things easier.

  • Janet,

    It sounds to me like you are better off for moving on.  From what you described, my perception of the problem is somebody was threatened by your abilities.  It's sad that people can't get over the fact there are other people that have more skills and are better at one thing or another.  They would be so much better off in the long run if they looked at that situation as an opportunity to learn and get better rather than be afraid of being looked at as not being able to do something as well as someone else.

    In the big picture, are technical skills really what define us as a person?  I think not.

  •  "I opened a DTS package; it transferred five tables from one database of one server to another database of another server. Well, how many connections would you create? Two right? I saw TEN connections - two for each table. The most amazing thing was the DTS package was written by a DBA who claimed to have over 10 years' experiences. "

    Actually, with only two connections, the table population would have to go one at a time (table1, then table2, then table3, ...). With one set of connections (source and destination) for each table, they can run in parallel (If memory serves, the default is 4 parallel processes at a time. This would mean a faster executing package.

    Maybe you should have asked the DBAs for the reason behind their design... 

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