January 8, 2021 at 7:33 pm
Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
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we travel not to escape life but for life not to escape us
Don't fear failure, fear regret.
January 8, 2021 at 8:05 pm
Lynn Pettis wrote:Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
Says the sheep. He is as much a dictator as Former President Obama.
I don't agree with his actions after the election, but I do agree that there needs to be an investigation into the election, not to over turn it but to ensure that the problems that occurred this year don't happen again in future years.
And, by the way, no previous President had to put up with fours years of obstruction like President Trump. The Democrats didn't accept the results of the 2016 election, so how is that any different from this year?
January 8, 2021 at 8:07 pm
below86 wrote:Brandie Tarvin wrote:david.edwards 76768 wrote:Don't want to turn this political, but thinking of you guys on the left side of the pond. I just finished re-watching the excellent West Wing two days ago after a 15 year wait, then was glued to 24 hour news last night. Fact can truly be stranger than fiction sometimes.
How does it feel to be living it?
A little traumatizing. I have family members who are Trump supporters (cannot figure out why as his policies are directly affecting their standard of living in a bad way) and I'm hoping none of them were stupid enough to be part of the initial rally and the chaos that followed.
Also, very PO'd at the Republicans who suddenly have problems with Trump as if they didn't see this coming. SERIOUSLY? As if!
Exactly my thoughts, even the hoping some relatives were not part of it.
The folks raiding the Capital buildings were just some nuts, probably qanons and boogaloos. I'm not going to lose my relationships with conservative friends and family because of some nuts. If you wonder why people vote for trump, just ask. I tell them why I vote otherwise if they want to know. The thing is, political policy is subjective and unproveable, and some issues held very deeply by folks can be used to wedge in policies that have nothing to do with the issues these folks hold very dear, but politics is politics.
Still, I think the scene was set in 2016 when the GOP primaries concluded and we ended up with you know who and heck for that matter, I hear that about the DNC's choice too. Was the USA really that short on credible candidates that we had to go the way we did?
On the other hand, I've held a theory that modern opportunities reward the most intelligent and capable people to an extend that, well, what high achieving thoughtful individual looks at a career in politics as something they want to do anymore when there are so many more interesting pursuits available? Heh for that matter, look at how we as a citizentry treat politicians we don't like, especially during campaign time? I mean who wants that mess? "Hey man I don't like your policies, let me vandalize your house."
The issue is that increasingly over the decades the republican party has had to become a more and more two faced party. On the one hand there are people who want small government with low taxes. On the hand to get the votes needed they've hand to increasingly politicize and pander to extremely emotional topics. Trump and specifically what happened Wednesday is a result of what happens when you pander to the latter a little too much.
January 8, 2021 at 8:13 pm
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
The only benefit I got from trump was a $1000 bonus check 4 years ago or so because of his tax cuts. And that really doesn't do anything to offset the absolute shit show the last year has been under his gross mismanagement of the pandemic.
January 8, 2021 at 8:22 pm
below86 wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
Says the sheep. He is as much a dictator as Former President Obama.
I don't agree with his actions after the election, but I do agree that there needs to be an investigation into the election, not to over turn it but to ensure that the problems that occurred this year don't happen again in future years.
And, by the way, no previous President had to put up with fours years of obstruction like President Trump. The Democrats didn't accept the results of the 2016 election, so how is that any different from this year?
Lynn you are hilarious. NOT! After getting the affordable care act passed early on I seem to remember republicans blocking almost every thing else they tried to do. That's one thing I find funny about republicans, when history doesn't meet their agenda they change it.(or forget the facts, but who needs facts and science)
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we travel not to escape life but for life not to escape us
Don't fear failure, fear regret.
January 8, 2021 at 8:25 pm
Lynn Pettis wrote:I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
The only benefit I got from trump was a $1000 bonus check 4 years ago or so because of his tax cuts. And that really doesn't do anything to offset the absolute shit show the last year has been under his gross mismanagement of the pandemic.
Let's see. The tax cuts put more money into my bank account every payday. That adds up over time. I will say I was lucky that I was already divorced when his tax cuts went into affect because it did change how spousal support was taxed. But that was a government still trying to collect as much in taxes as it could. Any bonuses I got in these last four years were either company bonuses based on company performance or my personal performance on a specific issue or issues. His tax cuts didn't play a part in those payments.
The pandemic, his mismanagement? Stop drinking the Kool-Aid. He may have done some things wrong, but he also did other things right. If you are going to call him out for what he did wrong, be sure to call out the doctorial governors at the state level as well. Both sides politicized the pandemic. And let's not forget Pelosi admitting she didn't want to put out a second stimulus package before the election. And look what was in the latest stimulus package. Really, billions of dollars to foreign governments for things that aren't even related to the pandemic? Sorry, but there is enough wrong to go around to everyone in power.
January 8, 2021 at 8:29 pm
below86 wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
Says the sheep. He is as much a dictator as Former President Obama.
I don't agree with his actions after the election, but I do agree that there needs to be an investigation into the election, not to over turn it but to ensure that the problems that occurred this year don't happen again in future years.
And, by the way, no previous President had to put up with fours years of obstruction like President Trump. The Democrats didn't accept the results of the 2016 election, so how is that any different from this year?
We should have a complete tear down of the entire voting system from top to bottom, not just this specific election. At least in this election the popular vote actually aligned with the electoral college vote unlike certain other elections....
January 8, 2021 at 8:31 pm
ZZartin wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
The only benefit I got from trump was a $1000 bonus check 4 years ago or so because of his tax cuts. And that really doesn't do anything to offset the absolute shit show the last year has been under his gross mismanagement of the pandemic.
Let's see. The tax cuts put more money into my bank account every payday. That adds up over time. I will say I was lucky that I was already divorced when his tax cuts went into affect because it did change how spousal support was taxed. But that was a government still trying to collect as much in taxes as it could. Any bonuses I got in these last four years were either company bonuses based on company performance or my personal performance on a specific issue or issues. His tax cuts didn't play a part in those payments.
The pandemic, his mismanagement? Stop drinking the Kool-Aid. He may have done some things wrong, but he also did other things right. If you are going to call him out for what he did wrong, be sure to call out the doctorial governors at the state level as well. Both sides politicized the pandemic. And let's not forget Pelosi admitting she didn't want to put out a second stimulus package before the election. And look what was in the latest stimulus package. Really, billions of dollars to foreign governments for things that aren't even related to the pandemic? Sorry, but there is enough wrong to go around to everyone in power.
Ultimately he was the president and he did virtually nothing right in the last year in regards to the pandemic. He couldn't even be bothered to do the bare minimum like ask people wear masks.
January 8, 2021 at 8:34 pm
Lynn Pettis wrote:below86 wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
Says the sheep. He is as much a dictator as Former President Obama.
I don't agree with his actions after the election, but I do agree that there needs to be an investigation into the election, not to over turn it but to ensure that the problems that occurred this year don't happen again in future years.
And, by the way, no previous President had to put up with fours years of obstruction like President Trump. The Democrats didn't accept the results of the 2016 election, so how is that any different from this year?
Lynn you are hilarious. NOT! After getting the affordable care act passed early on I seem to remember republicans blocking almost every thing else they tried to do. That's one thing I find funny about republicans, when history doesn't meet their agenda they change it.(or forget the facts, but who needs facts and science)
Yes, the ACA. Honestly, the Supreme Court should have declared that unconstitutional. To be honest, Social Security should have been ruled unconstitutional back in the 30's when it was passed. Sorry, but the Federal Government over stepped its authority. Don't tell me the general welfare clause covers it. The powers of the Federal Government are limited and expressly written in the Constitution of the United States.
January 8, 2021 at 8:44 pm
Lynn Pettis wrote:below86 wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
Says the sheep. He is as much a dictator as Former President Obama.
I don't agree with his actions after the election, but I do agree that there needs to be an investigation into the election, not to over turn it but to ensure that the problems that occurred this year don't happen again in future years.
And, by the way, no previous President had to put up with fours years of obstruction like President Trump. The Democrats didn't accept the results of the 2016 election, so how is that any different from this year?
We should have a complete tear down of the entire voting system from top to bottom, not just this specific election. At least in this election the popular vote actually aligned with the electoral college vote unlike certain other elections....
You do realize that we don't elect the President based on a single National Election or the popular vote. In fact, at one time we didn't even vote for the President and/or Vice President, we voted for Electors who then gathered and actually debated and argued over who would become the President and the Vice President. Today it is 50 separate and independent State elections for the President. You want the election of the President to be purely on the populare vote? Well, then California and New York will be the deciding factor in future elections. The founders of our country established the Electoral College to keep the more populous States from dominating the electoral process. Without it we wouldn't even be here now as the Southern States would not have joined the Union after the Revolutionary War because that was their fear, that the North would dominate the electoral process.
January 8, 2021 at 8:55 pm
ZZartin wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:below86 wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:Yes, I voted for Trump in 2016. First, he wasn't my first choice. Second, there was no way on Gods green earth I was voting for an unindicted, unconvicted felon for President. I am sorry if there are those of you who disagree, but Hillary Clinton and her entire staff that worked for her when she was Secretary of State should be be in prison for mishandling classified information. Period. Any of us on this thread or forum had done what she and her staff did would be prison. We would also, upon release, more than likely unable to obtain any sort of government clearance. And her saying she wasn't told, horse manure. Anyone who has a security clearance goes through mandatory annual training. If we don't complete the training, we lose are clearance and more than likely our job. We need to hold all government officials to this standard, elected and appointed. Period.
I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
So many lies, I see why you like the 'dictator'. Why isn't he held to the same standards? If it was a democ0art in office and tried to pull a coup like T*** did, the republicans would be loosing their mind and would have already impeached the president.
Open your eyes, don't be sheep.
Says the sheep. He is as much a dictator as Former President Obama.
I don't agree with his actions after the election, but I do agree that there needs to be an investigation into the election, not to over turn it but to ensure that the problems that occurred this year don't happen again in future years.
And, by the way, no previous President had to put up with fours years of obstruction like President Trump. The Democrats didn't accept the results of the 2016 election, so how is that any different from this year?
We should have a complete tear down of the entire voting system from top to bottom, not just this specific election. At least in this election the popular vote actually aligned with the electoral college vote unlike certain other elections....
You do realize that we don't elect the President based on a single National Election or the popular vote. In fact, at one time we didn't even vote for the President and/or Vice President, we voted for Electors who then gathered and actually debated and argued over who would become the President and the Vice President. Today it is 50 separate and independent State elections for the President. You want the election of the President to be purely on the populare vote? Well, then California and New York will be the deciding factor in future elections. The founders of our country established the Electoral College to keep the more populous States from dominating the electoral process. Without it we wouldn't even be here now as the Southern States would not have joined the Union after the Revolutionary War because that was their fear, that the North would dominate the electoral process.
I fully realize that's how the current system works. And the way the current system works is that people in say Texas don't get to whine and complain about how say Pennsylvania conducts their election just because they don't like the results.
January 8, 2021 at 8:56 pm
I'd like to hear Lynn's case on the unconstitutionality of both the ACA and Social Security.
Whadya say Lynn, can you make an argument that isn't simply asserting an opinion?
For instance, I can reason that the individual mandate is constitutional, because if you could frame the "penalty" imposed by not buying insurance differently, it would then pass muster if you framed it as a "tax deduction for insurance costs" that are simply not available to you as a deduction if you don't buy insurance. But it is still functionally, mathematically equivalent, and if you can make it constitutional just by renaming terms, do we REALLY have a constitutional argument against it?
So, is it UNCONSTITUTIONAL to offer a tax break to folks purchasing health insurance? Are tax breaks unconstitutional upon themselves?
After all, when the penalty was called a "tax", the courts gave it the go ahead. Simply by renaming it from "penalty" to a "tax."
January 8, 2021 at 8:56 pm
Lynn Pettis wrote:ZZartin wrote:Lynn Pettis wrote:I don't agree with many things Trump has said, but that is probably true of many people. I do, however, know that I have done better under four years of Trump than 8 years under Obama. I am not looking forward to what the next two years have instore for us.
The only benefit I got from trump was a $1000 bonus check 4 years ago or so because of his tax cuts. And that really doesn't do anything to offset the absolute shit show the last year has been under his gross mismanagement of the pandemic.
Let's see. The tax cuts put more money into my bank account every payday. That adds up over time. I will say I was lucky that I was already divorced when his tax cuts went into affect because it did change how spousal support was taxed. But that was a government still trying to collect as much in taxes as it could. Any bonuses I got in these last four years were either company bonuses based on company performance or my personal performance on a specific issue or issues. His tax cuts didn't play a part in those payments.
The pandemic, his mismanagement? Stop drinking the Kool-Aid. He may have done some things wrong, but he also did other things right. If you are going to call him out for what he did wrong, be sure to call out the doctorial governors at the state level as well. Both sides politicized the pandemic. And let's not forget Pelosi admitting she didn't want to put out a second stimulus package before the election. And look what was in the latest stimulus package. Really, billions of dollars to foreign governments for things that aren't even related to the pandemic? Sorry, but there is enough wrong to go around to everyone in power.
Ultimately he was the president and he did virtually nothing right in the last year in regards to the pandemic. He couldn't even be bothered to do the bare minimum like ask people wear masks.
You seem to think that the President of the United States has all this power, the ability to tell every State what they have to do. Sorry, the only way he could have exerted that kind of authority is to have declared Martial Law throughout the United States. Imagine how well that would have gone over. Remember, the Constitution explicitly defines the powers of the Federal Government. Anything not expressly stated belongs to the States and the People.
Why should he have asked the people to wear masks? Plus, asking doesn't mandate wearing masks, and there would more than likely be many who still would have refused to wear masks. And how effect has mask wearing actually been? Depending on what you read there are those that tout its effectiveness and just as many the doubt its effectiveness.
January 8, 2021 at 9:08 pm
The moron knew last January that it was going to be bad(Covid), but he kept saying it would go away. And his followers believe anything that comes out of his mouth. If he would have done his duty he would have been honest. For god sakes he's on tape saying it, but I guess we should ignore that, like other facts.
As my grandpa used to say "you can't fix stupid". And I would add "you can't argue with stupid".
-------------------------------------------------------------
we travel not to escape life but for life not to escape us
Don't fear failure, fear regret.
January 8, 2021 at 9:10 pm
oh lord, anti-maskers LOL!
I remember in one of my weaker moments trying to convince an anti-masker to reconsider and this person literally had the gall to ask me "what business is it of yours" when it was PRECISELY the reason first offered for wearing masks, that it protects others around you. I think thats when it started settling in how irrational many of us can be, so I gave up on that account, and knowing folks's politics I feel justified in being disappointed but not in being surprised.
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