March 4, 2009 at 6:03 am
Mangal Pardeshi (3/4/2009)
Bingo!!!atleast someone consider the point I'm making.
Dugi (3/4/2009)
It would be better to change the color of the accepted post as solution for the user if the problem solved!I suggest before that if we have solution to close the post but Steve said that we can have alternative solutions so in this case the best way should be to colorize the answered post differently from default posts and make it as accepted solution and sure that we can post other alternatives and the moderators can change them the color!
Color example for accepted solution = Green!
But the problem still remains, who decides?
Scenario:
1. Someone posts a problem
2. A quick-and-dirty response, which is slow will only apply in specific cases but which works here.
3. OP marks post green and gets on with life
4. Someone else, who read the post before the Q&D reply, posts a detailed solution which would apply in many more situations, however, OP now has a solution so doesn't bother to read/flag further answers
5. Someone in a hurry, with a similar problem, just reads the green post (since they don't have time to read and understand the 'article' which was added later) and implements a poor solution which wastes resources
Without the post flagging, the person looking for a solution might at least skim over the whole thread and realized there's a better solution. However, if you start flagging particular posts as the answer then you foster an attitude where people don't bother to try and improve their skills and just expect to implement boilerplate fixes.
As previously mentioned, I might support flagging entire threads as 'Answered', i.e. indicating that at least one solution to the problem has been posted. It's just the flagging of specific posts that I'm not happy about.
Derek
March 4, 2009 at 6:08 am
Mangal Pardeshi (3/4/2009)
dear Grant,Honestly I'm reading your name for the first time.
Not entirely true. I've responded to other posts of yours in the past. 😎
But all the same, you have to understand exactly how we can take this kind of thing personally. You posted a list of things that I do almost every day in an effort to help and you posted them as a list of things that should NOT be done, are even harmful. That's a bit upsetting to say the least.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood"
- Theodore Roosevelt
Author of:
SQL Server Execution Plans
SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
March 4, 2009 at 6:15 am
Mangal Pardeshi (3/4/2009)
If YOU are not doing that, doesn't mean don't happen in SSC or for that matter on any other Online forum, and if you are not doing that you shouldn't take it perosnally, about 1-2 things I observed or I felt.
But we are doing it, and for very good reasons. That's why people are getting offended.
You didn't initially say one person. You said (and I quote) "I followed some of those Top rankers in last few days, and I have rarely seen there replies as helpful"
Top rankers (plural). You're saying essentially that the top ranking people here are rarely helpful. That's a broad generalisation and quite frankly it is insulting.
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
March 4, 2009 at 6:18 am
Mangel,
As far as marking posts as answered, sure I see some value in it, but I also have had several experiences where I have posted an answer that will work, but later someone else has posted a BETTER way to do it. This second solution may never have been presented had a post been marked as answered or my answer marked as accepted. Then not only would the OP have missed out an opportunity to have learned a better way, but so would I.
I also ask a lot of questions like why, what are you trying to accomplish, and what have you tried thus far many times because I don't understand the original post, sometimes because it's over my head, sometimes because the OP wasn't clear. In both situations I am just trying to learn more about the problem so I can either provide a solution or so I can clearly say I don't know I hope someone else helps you out.
Some of this is because of the way I choose which problems to answer. I typically only choose posts that have 2 or fewer replies, even when I don't necessarily believe I am an expert in the area. Then I sometimes spend up to 30 minutes researching to find the answer before I post. Sometimes the answer I provide is a link I found in my research or just a link to my google search because I don't know the answer, but some of the links look like good possibilities. Many times I'm not providing the best answer, and I know this because I after I have "bumped" the question back to the first page of the Active Threads list with my question or link a real expert provides a better answer.
When I do post code I try to explain the code as well, because just providing an answer without the why's of the answer doesn't really help anyone.
Jack Corbett
Consultant - Straight Path Solutions
Check out these links on how to get faster and more accurate answers:
Forum Etiquette: How to post data/code on a forum to get the best help
Need an Answer? Actually, No ... You Need a Question
March 4, 2009 at 6:24 am
Mangal Pardeshi (3/4/2009)
Please, my intention is to make SSC EVEN MORE better place.
That's why I'm try to debate this issue. I don't feel that marking posts as 'Best Answer' is a good idea since often there is a lot of information in the rest of the thread.
My mothertounge is not English so perhaps I'm getting the exact words to present my point so Please don't catch the words from my mouth.
There are many people here who's first language is not english, that's sometimes why the question "what are you trying to do?" gets asked, because the original post was not clear.
TOP posters doesn't mean top 1,2,3. I'm just referring to some people with quite big number of posts.
There is always some room for improvements. I'm NOT joking by saying I "felt" someone just posting to increase the visibility, by saying that you are offending me.
If YOU are not doing that, doesn't mean don't happen in SSC or for that matter on any other Online forum, and if you are not doing that you shouldn't take it perosnally, about 1-2 things I observed or I felt.
I assumed by "top posters", you meant people with several thousand posts/points, not literally the 1st, 2nd, 3rd... etc.
I think that most of the people with high post counts keep posting because they want to help people. The actual post count doesn't matter to them.
Derek
March 4, 2009 at 6:35 am
Steve,
I just noticed that there is a rank this thread option when you first enter a thread. What about moving that to a rank this post. That way instead of marking an answer as selected, you can rank the quality of the solution. I know that there are threads where I have posted to recommend one solution over another and if I could rank an answer I might do that instead of having a post saying: "I agree with [insert name here]'s solution"
Jack Corbett
Consultant - Straight Path Solutions
Check out these links on how to get faster and more accurate answers:
Forum Etiquette: How to post data/code on a forum to get the best help
Need an Answer? Actually, No ... You Need a Question
March 4, 2009 at 6:42 am
Mangal Pardeshi (3/4/2009)
I can make out who is asking for right intention and who is just increasing his pots counts.
Can you really?
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
March 4, 2009 at 6:44 am
please... don't do this.
I kindly request you.
GilaMonster (3/4/2009)
Mangal Pardeshi (3/4/2009)
I can make out who is asking for right intention and who is just increasing his pots counts.Can you really?
John Smith
March 4, 2009 at 6:45 am
Sorry guys just let me say a quick word.
I personally feel there is no right answer to any question, what we provide are optimal solutions and its OP's decision to pick the right one, again according to his business requirements. Why we say business requirements its because no other IT guy is as close to the business as DBA's are. So, this question is always asked, there is nothing wrong in it. I am the biggest fan of this forum and I cant imagine even one day without logging into it, its become an important part of my life:P, though you don't see me much but I am always on this and I try to share knowledge and build up my knowledge as much as I can.
Pointing to articles: Well I don't find anything wrong in it. you obviously learn something new everyday and you share the resources you have and believe me, I learned a lot just by reading the articles in this forum and also links pointing out to articles.
And Mangal - may be you did not find much help with them I strongly disagree with that, they are the top contributors in this forum and its just because of their contribution and their own effort that you are here or I am here. I always find some helpful information in their posts or their discussion. May be you find the question "What are your business requirements" not useful but for me, it gives me a chance to re think and analyze more about it.
I am sure no one here is looking to raise their points or posts, everyone here are looking for knowledge and try and help others.
I am quite happy the way it is. Steve, I think you should start a Poll may be including some features that you want to add.
March 4, 2009 at 6:48 am
Anyone else picking up on someone who has posted a lot in the last 24 hours, perhaps just to increase visibility?
March 4, 2009 at 6:57 am
Just tossing in my two cents. I know I will post various links quite a bit as well as code snippets where I can. I doubt you're referencing me but maybe your are, it doesn't matter. If I see a post without any replies, I'll open it up, read the issue and if I don't have an answer, I'll usually Google it. If I find something that I believe can be useful, I will paste in the links that I think are relevant. I will also tell the OP that I used Google, pointing to an additional tool that they could be using to solve their problem. I make the effort and share my time to help where I can, whatever the resource.
Also, all of the top posters get frustrated having to drag information out of the OP or as, I think Gail stated (another "Saint" - IMO), a topic has been posted over and over that she'll put on her blog for simple redirection to the answer. If the OP were to try and help his/her self first, many things have already been answered many times over (think "I have no backup and deleted data, how do I get it back?") and possibly get a quicker resolution. As has been stated within the topic, we're doing this freely to "help a brother (or sister) out". And honestly, many times along the way I've found myself learning more than I'm giving back. Most of us do try our best to lead the OP down the right path to an appropriate resolution.
Lastly, I personally don't pay attention to my points count BUT the count does allow me to know who the true gurus are on the site (and there are MANY). More often than not, when I see they've posted a reply to a topic, I know the OP is receiving the best advice to solve their issue. Another IMO.
OK, I feel better now! 😀
-- You can't be late until you show up.
March 4, 2009 at 7:00 am
Scott Arendt (3/4/2009)
Anyone else picking up on someone who has posted a lot in the last 24 hours, perhaps just to increase visibility?
I thought the same thing but didn't want to mention it. 😉
-- You can't be late until you show up.
March 4, 2009 at 7:49 am
Heh... has anyone noticed than Mangal deleted all but one of his posts here? And, take a look at the following... he'll be an excellent poster because of the extreme patience and tenacity he's demonstrated...
http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic668144-4-1.aspx#bm668207
Mangal, I'm not going to that other post, so I'm hoping you're still watching this one. I've looked at your posts and you're no different than the rest of us... you make mistakes, you're occasionally sarcastic, you point people to other links... the big difference is you never do ask why and, as a result, you give people what could be some very bad advise like splitting a time into 4 columns...
Maybe when you get over a couple thousand posts, you'll understand the value of asking "Why do you want to do this?"... it's meant to protect the poor dummy trying to fall on the "SQL Sword". And, besides... it's a forum! I'll ask the question even after the question has been answered because I really want to know either because there might be a better answer if we know or because I just wann know.
In the mean time, take your own advice... sit back, relax, post where you can or where you want, have some fun, and pray they never start such a point system... you might just find out that you're just like the rest of us. 😉
--Jeff Moden
Change is inevitable... Change for the better is not.
March 4, 2009 at 7:59 am
I was wondering if anyone else had noticed that the post that started the party had been deleted. Unfortunately that post still lives on in this thread since I had quoted it in a reply. I hadn't noticed that he deleted most of his posts, however, until Jeff pointed it out.
Doing that just makes this thread a lot less intelligible, I mean, what are we complaining about now since he deleted his part of the thread. People that read this thread now will have no real idea what was going on here.
March 4, 2009 at 8:01 am
I'm a little late to this thread, since I was sick in bed all day yesterday. But, just to get my post-count up, I'm going to post this. 🙂
After all, I only help a few dozen people every week on this page, so in order to stay in the top 10, I need every bit of fluff I can possible get!
Heck, I should start a thread and just post dozens of replies to it myself. That would get my count up! And would obviously be much more helpful than actually giving people what they need in order to solve their actual problems.
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
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