December 4, 2009 at 7:10 am
When SSMS came out with 2005 I was very disappointed to see EM and QA combined. I'd still prefer to have my query application separate from the management application. I have gotten used to SSMS, but..
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December 4, 2009 at 7:33 am
I think the problem the SQL Server team at Microsoft has had with deciding what features to put in what tool could be partly because of the way so many smaller and mid-sized companies use SQL Server. No one would ever even think of running an Oracle database without having a DBA, but in the Microsoft world that seems to happen frequently, even on accident sometimes when some product or third party tool uses SQL Server without the user knowing about it. So there are people who have to wear all the hats and want all the tools in one place. Other companies have more specialized people that just want to be able to do what they need to do.
From my perspective, the problem with shoving too many features in one product like Management Studio or Visual Studio is that running these products takes up a huge portion of memory, end up running slower, and give the users a dizzying array of buttons and menu options that they need to learn which does what task. When I was primarily an Oracle person, I used each tool individually, and many times I wish I could do the same in SQL Server.
December 4, 2009 at 7:48 am
I think part of the decision by MS was so they could use the VS framework, which gives them some nice features without a lot of coding.
However, I think it was a mistake. Many of us seem to prefer many smaller tools. And for organization, make a folder on your desktop, put all the icons in there, easy enough to do. Or make a menu in each tool that can launch all the others.
December 4, 2009 at 7:48 am
"If a things worth doing it can probably be done in Notepad" 😀
December 4, 2009 at 8:04 am
I tinkered with version 7, but really used the product with version 2000 and upwards. In response to the article i would rather have a number of tools that allow me to do the task well, regardless of the number of applications etc.
December 4, 2009 at 8:13 am
I really like the "merged" version of SSMS that started with 2005. Thought it was great because I always had them both open at the same time anyway. I also think it flows better that way when you're scripting out admin actions and/or objects. That's my $.02, and it won't even get you a cup of coffee anymore...:pinch:
December 4, 2009 at 8:49 am
Unfortunately this is the trend - keep packing more stuff into the tools - so you can keep selling them over and over again. If you create something that works great and does not break, pretty soon you will be out of business... Look what happened to the company that made Crocs...
I like small specialized tools. It is easier to figure out what they do and in most cases they are very portable. Pack a USB stick with all the tools you need - go to the customer, use what you need and get out without leaving a trail of DLLs and other junk (my long gone other life - not SQL related).
PS. Notepad is my thing too, but I work with a guy who uses Visio for EVERYTHING (except coding).
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December 4, 2009 at 9:17 am
I am a developer\dba\etc IT worker and I like SSMS as-is with only one complaint: I would like the abiliity to undock and float multiple query\resultset windows around my desktop. When I am debugging\researching it is not uncommon to have four or more query windows open. Tabbing back and forth repeatedly to see stuff is unproductive. If there is a user config option in SSMS to allow this please tell me how to set it!
December 4, 2009 at 9:21 am
deanroush (12/4/2009)
I am a developer\dba\etc IT worker and I like SSMS as-is with only one complaint: I would like the abiliity to undock and float multiple query\resultset windows around my desktop. When I am debugging\researching it is not uncommon to have four or more query windows open. Tabbing back and forth repeatedly to see stuff is unproductive. If there is a user config option in SSMS to allow this please tell me how to set it!
You can change the General Environment option (from Tools, Options) to MDI from Tabbed, and get one window per connection. Then you can have them next to each other pretty easily. That's usually the first step I take when I first open a newly installed instance of SSMS.
If you have multiple monitors, you can either stretch SSMS over them, or have one copy open per monitor, and then use the windowing option, and you get pretty much what you're asking for.
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December 4, 2009 at 9:39 am
To the Q of the day. So some years, I like the tool that has everything I need. Other years, I find myself piecing together different tools to get the job done.
We will always have both! Depending on your skill set and the tasks at hand, SQL Server may have all the tools you require. As our knowledge (and hopefully, wisdom!) increases, as the tasks change, we may have to look outside of SQL Server to find the right tool for the right job. When it becomes apparent that a particular tool is used by the majority, I suspect MS will create some version of the tool, or buy out the company that made the tool, and incorporate it into an upgrade version.
Currently, we are mostly using the tools provided in SQL Server. However, our outside toolset has been increasing and I will be looking at new tools soon, as it's time to submit a new budget...
December 4, 2009 at 9:44 am
For devices like phone, watch, planner, mp3 player, browser - and the like, I prefer "one device to rule them all" rather than having to keep track of all this stuff.
When it comes to tools of the trade, I prefer better tools over integrated tools. That's going to cost me - because it means separate licenses. Visual Studio 2010 Premium will include a lot of the database developer tools that were previously only available in Team Foundation Server Developer Edition. That's a game changer.
Finally I can get those great developer tools with a non-TFS VS license. So I'll be doing most database development not in SSMS, but in VS 2010 where I can do unit tests, source control, change scripts, data generation and so forth.
I think for Microsoft, it's a good move to make these database development tools available outside of TFS. I think there are tons of shops that shouldn't have to buy TFS just to get these tools. I think it's a good move for the SQL Server community - and will promote best practices in the programmability space - that have been hampered in part by the barriers to entry of TFS.
So I think placing those programmability tools into the VS Premium license - making them more accessible to us is better than locking them in only TFS. However, I don't fully agree with choosing not to add them to SSMS. I get it that it makes Microsoft more money because they can charge for a SQL Server license and VS license.
I get it that "Management Studio" implies that the tool is really geared toward "management" and not development while Visual Studio is the development environment. But let's not play games with names. The tool name can be changed.
I venture to guess that the majority of the SQL Server community don't use TFS and never have - and so we've been without these database developer tools. So test-driven development, unit tests, change scripts and other practices have largely gone by the wayside in part because the tools aren't there in SSMS.
On these community and forum sites, we've been talking about how to do these things in the absence of the TFS tools. We talk about using SSMS solutions and projects to organize our scripts, about using open-source tools like TSQL Unit to do unit tests, about using RedGate data generator to generate test data. So for most of us, SSMS is our database development platform and then we augment it with other tools. And now Microsoft wants to move us out of there and into VS 2010.
It's not just a matter of making us use a different development platform. There are licensing considerations, there are role adjustments, and other adjustments to be made. In theory, it seems straightforward - but the reality might be different.
In the end - I'm not really complaining. I'm just making observations.
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December 4, 2009 at 10:07 am
I prefer to have a smaller tool that does one thing really well to a bigger tool that does a couple things well and everything else poorly or ok.. Another poster brought up cell-phones.. I too like to have it do as much as possible but on my desk I don't mind having more than one device, on my belt is a different matter.
CEWII
December 4, 2009 at 10:26 am
Awesome, I was waiting for an LOTR reference. Well done.
December 4, 2009 at 10:29 am
jaldridge (12/4/2009)
Awesome, I was waiting for an LOTR reference. Well done.
It is kind of hard to avoid in a discussion like this..
CEWII
December 4, 2009 at 11:45 am
I too started with SQL v4.2 on OS2/Warp and have witnessed the 'evolution' of the 'tools' that a SQL Server DBA has available.
SSMS is a great all around tool for Developers and Development DBAs IMHO.
However 99.44% of my work is Production Support so most probably 85-90% of SSMS is unused (and just gets in the way) of being an effective DBA. All of those 'extra' windows, drill downs and hovering over applets to figure something out seem like a small price to pay. But consider having to perform the same wasted activities tens to possibly a hundred times a day - it adds up really quickly in an environment of 350+ and growing SQL Servers (yup, they are all registered !!!). So I still use SQL 2000 ISQLW heavily !
My 'select' toolset for Production a DBA to be separated includes:
- Query Analyzer - ala SQL 2000 because of the Object Browser option
- Server Registration Manager
- errorlog Viewer
- Job Activity Monitor
- Activity Monitor
- Replication Monitor
- Database Mail Monitor
-MSX/TSX Monitor
- SSIS/Maintenance Plan Designer
Oh, I cannot forget the 2 most important 'new' options that would make this 'select' toolset even more functional and useful:
- command line interface
- variable config file command option for each tool
The first option would allow for one to set up discreet 'environments' via a simple shortcut that would in turn invoke what 'select' tools would open on demand.
The second option is really the most important - imagine being able to open up each 'select' function automatically to exactly what servers you need to deal with. For those that deal with groups of servers separated by say datacenter or geographic world locations this would probably be a great time save - I know it would be for me !
RegardsRudy KomacsarSenior Database Administrator"Ave Caesar! - Morituri te salutamus."
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