August 21, 2023 at 12:00 am
Comments posted to this topic are about the item A Real World Clash with AIs
August 21, 2023 at 7:57 am
Another concern is that disabling a sensor could pose a risk to others.
After migrating a massive number of documents for the AAIB and MAIB earlier in my career I became and avid watcher of Air Crash Investigation. One fatal accident was caused by a atmospheric sensor port being covered with duct tape when the aircraft was cleaned but not removed afterwards. This wrought havoc with the fly by wire controls causing the jet to crash.
The 1st thing I do when I start my wife's Skoda is to turn off the lane assist function. It's dangerous. It either doesn't work when you expect it to or activates when you least expect and want it. If lane assist doesn't yet behave I fear for the susceptibility of non-rail autonomous vehicles.
August 21, 2023 at 12:21 pm
A couple years back there was an article about being able to keep an "autonomous" vehicle from moving, by simply making a large circle around it on the ground with paint or something white. The issue with so-called "AI" systems right now, whether in vehicles or anything else is a decided lack of "common sense."
The common sense to be able to realize that the line in front of the vehicle is NOT a lane marker and just drive over it, the common sense to realize the sudden surge of CPU utilization doesn't warrant an alert being sent out because it happens EVERY week at the same time, etc.
Granted, of course, not every human has the same level of common sense, but most do.
Honestly, I'm with David.Poole, I'm mostly OK with autonomous trains, I'd even be OK with autonomous vehicles in a "convoy" sort of situation, where at a minimum the lead vehicle is being actively driven by a human and the remainder are just "following the leader," yet even then I'd want a persons' butt in the seat in case a sensor glitches or other such unforeseeable events.
August 21, 2023 at 12:31 pm
After migrating a massive number of documents for the AAIB and MAIB earlier in my career I became and avid watcher of Air Crash Investigation. One fatal accident was caused by a atmospheric sensor port being covered with duct tape when the aircraft was cleaned but not removed afterwards. This wrought havoc with the fly by wire controls causing the jet to crash.
Good lord. This is where checklists and secondary checks are supposed to come into play. There should also have been some sort of indication on the output of this sensor in the cockpit... especially since it does have such an impact on the Fly-by-Wire system.
We used to say it way back in the days of monolithic, centralized computers and green-bar paper... "To err is human... to really screw things up, you need a computer".
The only thing that has changed in that area is that it's gotten worse because there are fewer and fewer human checks involved and then humans are either skipping the checks or they've become totally stupid and useless.
--Jeff Moden
Change is inevitable... Change for the better is not.
August 21, 2023 at 1:21 pm
Another concern is that disabling a sensor could pose a risk to others.
The 1st thing I do when I start my wife's Skoda is to turn off the lane assist function. It's dangerous. It either doesn't work when you expect it to or activates when you least expect and want it. If lane assist doesn't yet behave I fear for the susceptibility of non-rail autonomous vehicles.
David, I have the same issues with a new Honda CRV we bought as our retirement run-around. The wobbling lane-change thing can be irritating, but I found the worst is that it wants to turn itself off at stop signs and then restart. I had to disable that first thing, but I have to do it each time I start the engine.
Then of course there's the irritating prompt on the screen that I have to respond to taking personal liability for operating the vehicle.
What's more, every time I get in and start it up, my cell phone rings as the bluetooth connects.
And my wife gets upset every time I ignore the GPS voice telling me where to turn.
Rick
Disaster Recovery = Backup ( Backup ( Your Backup ) )
August 21, 2023 at 5:37 pm
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The 1st thing I do when I start my wife's Skoda is to turn off the lane assist function. It's dangerous. It either doesn't work when you expect it to or activates when you least expect and want it. If lane assist doesn't yet behave I fear for the susceptibility of non-rail autonomous vehicles.
I actually hate that the lane assist in the Tesla, which works well, turns off if there are too many violations, like in a construction zone, or trying to get past bicycles. I think it's dangerous that someone who might need it or depend on it (tired, etc.) loses it because it thinks turning off is better than repeated violations.
August 21, 2023 at 7:05 pm
With all new technologies I'm conflicted. I can see so many benefits to autonomous vehicles. Pre-COVID I would say that my car was in use for only 7% of the time. That is not high when considering that it represents the 2nd highest purchase in my life after my house. Post COVID it is barely makes it to 1%.
At that level a PAYG autonomous vehicle becomes immensely appealing.
For disabled people who rely on public transport or friends an autonomous vehicle represents flexibility they can currently only dream of.
I do have concerns about the current generation of vehicles. Adaptive cruise control works, sort of. With other features it feels like we have quite a way to go before fully autonomous vehicles are a thing.
I am very wary of the UK press coverage of electric vehicles. Electric and autonomous are going to be intertwangled as a concept. They press are majoring on the downsides of owning an electric vehicle and in some cases stirring up fear and doubt. I know electric vehicles are flammable, but the way the UK press cover that fact you would think that petrol was an inert liquid.
August 22, 2023 at 3:38 pm
So some folks are driving around town with a cone on their car - to protest other people's use of their car? Are they protesting congestion (which makes no sense) or do they have a problem with autonomous cars specifically?
"Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the wise. Instead, seek what they sought." - Matsuo Basho
August 22, 2023 at 3:40 pm
I'm not sure the cone placers are driving. They are protesting cars in general, and assuming autonomous cars are adding to the problem, not solving them.
Personally, I think Zip cars (hourly rentals from an app) and autonomous cars could reduce the need for many people to keep cars in the city and this protest is misplaced.
August 23, 2023 at 3:21 pm
I do have concerns about the current generation of vehicles. Adaptive cruise control works, sort of. With other features it feels like we have quite a way to go before fully autonomous vehicles are a thing.
Check this out. Very impressive to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruKJCiAOmfg
Surprising too. Driving around London is crazy.
August 23, 2023 at 3:51 pm
If I ever get hit by one of these things I'm going to become very wealthy suing for liability and negligence.
Rick
Disaster Recovery = Backup ( Backup ( Your Backup ) )
August 29, 2023 at 4:00 pm
So some folks are driving around town with a cone on their car - to protest other people's use of their car? Are they protesting congestion (which makes no sense) or do they have a problem with autonomous cars specifically?
Eric: In one news bit I saw, the people doing the protesting were getting around on bikes. They had cones strapped to the back of their bikes and when they saw an autonomous vehicle which didn't have any people inside, they put the cone on the hood. In addition to the no-people-inside rule, there's also a rule of not doing this on bus routes. I think I also heard that there was some rule about not doing it on busy streets or fast streets or something.
I've heard two reasons for the cone protest effort. I'm guessing that both are in play at various levels for different participants: One is that people want to see more resources devoted to group public transportation, not more individual cars on the road. The other reason is that they resent having their city being used as a guinea pig for this technology.
They are showing how easy it is for the vehicles to get into trouble. Though I think the vehicles might do a good enough job of that on their own. For no reason at all that the humans could figure out, one test drive that a reporter took ended up stopping, blocking traffic, and the taxi company had to send a human (in a car) to drive the stopped car...
August 29, 2023 at 5:06 pm
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