Today's Humor..

  • Alvin Ramard (7/30/2014)


    WAIT!!!! What kind of database MUST be repaired regularly???? :w00t:

    MS Access ones.

    That actually is correct advice, for an MS Access database (as in Access tables) used by multiple people. They generally need a 'compact and repair' on a very regular basis. Only MS Access though

    Gail Shaw
    Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
    SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability

    We walk in the dark places no others will enter
    We stand on the bridge and no one may pass
  • In other words, the manual and support scripts were written when the application used an Access database. When they moved up to SQL Server, they simply added the part about simple recovery mode and left the rest alone, yielding the statement that makes no sense.

    I find it scary that someone would actually publish such a document about their product. This means that it made it from the writers to the technical review and through to publishing. If this is the level of attention they give to details that people can see, I wonder what their code looks like. No, wait...I take that back. I don't want to see their code, as it might make my eyes bleed.

  • It's very possible the manual and support have been trained on how to handle perf on MySQL as well and might be mis-interpreting it with MSSQL. They are, afterall, only 1 letter different.:-D

    They love the "shrink" as a perf tuning exercise in MySQL.

    Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
    _______________________________________________
    I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
    SQL RNNR
    Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
    Learn Extended Events

  • I hired in to a software company and sad to say we were one of those vendors. Gladly we are not anymore as I rewrote all of our recommendations to clients documentation. A little education goes a long way. 🙂

  • Sarah Wagner (7/31/2014)


    I hired in to a software company and sad to say we were one of those vendors. Gladly we are not anymore as I rewrote all of our recommendations to clients documentation. A little education goes a long way. 🙂

    Thank you!

    One down 678,342 to go...

    ----------------------------------------------------
    The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood... Theodore Roosevelt
    The Scary DBA
    Author of: SQL Server 2017 Query Performance Tuning, 5th Edition and SQL Server Execution Plans, 3rd Edition
    Product Evangelist for Red Gate Software

  • Grant Fritchey (7/31/2014)


    Sarah Wagner (7/31/2014)


    I hired in to a software company and sad to say we were one of those vendors. Gladly we are not anymore as I rewrote all of our recommendations to clients documentation. A little education goes a long way. 🙂

    Thank you!

    One down 678,342 to go...

    Grant, I think you left out a few. 😉



    Alvin Ramard
    Memphis PASS Chapter[/url]

    All my SSC forum answers come with a money back guarantee. If you didn't like the answer then I'll gladly refund what you paid for it.

    For best practices on asking questions, please read the following article: Forum Etiquette: How to post data/code on a forum to get the best help[/url]

  • Sarah Wagner (7/31/2014)


    I hired in to a software company and sad to say we were one of those vendors. Gladly we are not anymore as I rewrote all of our recommendations to clients documentation. A little education goes a long way. 🙂

    You're taking some of our fun away 😉

    Seriously though, I think the education only works if it is coming from within the organization. I'm sure most of us have had similar experiences trying to educate vendors from outside their walls. They want none of it.

    Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
    _______________________________________________
    I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
    SQL RNNR
    Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
    Learn Extended Events

  • SQLRNNR (7/31/2014)


    Sarah Wagner (7/31/2014)


    I hired in to a software company and sad to say we were one of those vendors. Gladly we are not anymore as I rewrote all of our recommendations to clients documentation. A little education goes a long way. 🙂

    You're taking some of our fun away 😉

    Seriously though, I think the education only works if it is coming from within the organization. I'm sure most of us have had similar experiences trying to educate vendors from outside their walls. They want none of it.

    That's because they already know everything. It's their product. They don't want a bunch of "users" of their product telling them how to make it work better.

  • I have to deal with a vendor who has the following advice in their Tuning and Scaling guide:

    Setting Recovery Model to Simple has the lowest amount of overhead over Full and Bulk-logged, which is crucial to the performance requirements needed for the (vendor redacted) databases.

    I debated about asking them for any whitepapers, or test results to back this assertion up. But apparently I am not allowed to talk to our vendors, anyway.

  • GilaMonster (7/31/2014)


    Alvin Ramard (7/30/2014)


    WAIT!!!! What kind of database MUST be repaired regularly???? :w00t:

    MS Access ones.

    That actually is correct advice, for an MS Access database (as in Access tables) used by multiple people. They generally need a 'compact and repair' on a very regular basis. Only MS Access though

    At least up to and including Access 2000, this was the standard practice. The risk was that the database would grow passed the 2Gb limit resulting in an unusable heap of ......

    Historical note: The operation created a new database, copied the data from the original one, purged it and renamed the new one.

    Somehow it looks like the old MS Access is still the impression some have of any Microsoft Database products.

    😎

  • As a general rule, vendors have very little knowledge of DBA best practices, so they just toss out some misinterpreted stuff that some junior developer found on some web site which may or may not apply to the current version of SQL Server. I have seen so many bad practices advocated by vendors that I expect it.

    The last vendor I had to deal with had an application that required the use of a specific SA password to connect to the database on a specifically named (non-default) instance. Having an application use a hard coded SA password is really bad security, but it's just some medical application, so no big deal. :crying:

    At least they didn't tell me to set the databases to simple recovery or not do backups.

    Another vendor application (for a building security system) required the use of a blank SA password so I guess it can always get worse.

  • SCARY!!!!!!



    Alvin Ramard
    Memphis PASS Chapter[/url]

    All my SSC forum answers come with a money back guarantee. If you didn't like the answer then I'll gladly refund what you paid for it.

    For best practices on asking questions, please read the following article: Forum Etiquette: How to post data/code on a forum to get the best help[/url]

  • Michael Valentine Jones (7/31/2014)


    As a general rule, vendors have very little knowledge of DBA best practices, so they just toss out some misinterpreted stuff that some junior developer found on some web site which may or may not apply to the current version of SQL Server. I have seen so many bad practices advocated by vendors that I expect it.

    The last vendor I had to deal with had an application that required the use of a specific SA password to connect to the database on a specifically named (non-default) instance. Having an application use a hard coded SA password is really bad security, but it's just some medical application, so no big deal. :crying:

    At least they didn't tell me to set the databases to simple recovery or not do backups.

    Another vendor application (for a building security system) required the use of a blank SA password so I guess it can always get worse.

    In my experience, this kind of applications have databases dating 15-20 years back when the structure was entirely different, sa was then the equivalent of being a member of sysadmin.

    Medical or medieval, those do not pass any decent compliance audit.

    😎

  • SQLRNNR (7/31/2014)


    Sarah Wagner (7/31/2014)


    I hired in to a software company and sad to say we were one of those vendors. Gladly we are not anymore as I rewrote all of our recommendations to clients documentation. A little education goes a long way. 🙂

    You're taking some of our fun away 😉

    Seriously though, I think the education only works if it is coming from within the organization. I'm sure most of us have had similar experiences trying to educate vendors from outside their walls. They want none of it.

    Abosolutely 100% easier from inside and still only about 50% success rate... :hehe:

  • Michael Valentine Jones (7/31/2014)


    The last vendor I had to deal with had an application that required the use of a specific SA password to connect to the database on a specifically named (non-default) instance. Having an application use a hard coded SA password is really bad security, but it's just some medical application, so no big deal. :crying:

    ...

    Another vendor application (for a building security system) required the use of a blank SA password so I guess it can always get worse.

    That's when you rename the sa login to something which sounds useless, disable it and create a new login called 'sa' with just the permissions you want it to have.

    Want sa? Sure, just gimme a couple minutes...

    Gail Shaw
    Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
    SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability

    We walk in the dark places no others will enter
    We stand on the bridge and no one may pass

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