December 10, 2019 at 9:28 am
We are small shop and we don't get to hire any dedicated consultant for performance tuning. Everything has to be done by us!
Thanks everyone. Forgive me if I have asked too much or hurt anyone.
Like the others, I get that. But go back and read what Lynn wrote and understand why some of us are a bit concerned. It doesn't look like anyone in your shop is actually trying (and there's a reason for that... read on). Worse, you've posted just about everything anyone could need to figure this out (except missing almost all the DDL for the tables and indexes), which means you know how to do at least that, and yet your shop has made no demonstrable attempts on it's own to fix this (again, there's a reason for that... read on).
I'm not so much concerned about this particular query. I'm not even so much concerned about the questions you've asked on behalf of your company, so far.
Judging from this question and others that you've recently asked, what I'm concerned about is that you good folks are using a tool that you apparently know very little about and have virtually no one that understands even the basics of writing queries never mind tuning queries or even designing tables/indexes and so I'm actually concerned for the company all of you are working for. If you don't get someone that understands how to do these things, you have a going-out-of-business plan for the company. And, no... none of you are going to learn this stuff overnight and you're certainly not going to learn what you need to learn to support your company from even the best recommendations or examples on this or any other forum. You need some training or someone that already is.
And, no... this is not meant as a personal slam. We're dealing with simple facts here and you folks need a better plan. This is "tough love" coming from someone that has seen companies crash and burn because they thought they could handle things on their own but couldn't and I don't want to see you folks go through that.
Well, ok... there is a bit of a personal slam I want to make. You guys are fighting amongst yourselves but you're all stupid when it comes to SQL. Realize that and stop your fighting. If you want the Developers to write better SQL, someone has to train them or they have to have the gumption to train themselves. Apparently the DBA team there doesn't have the licks for it, either, and could strongly benefit from some training or someone developing a little gumption on their own. You folks need to stop fighting each other and realize all of that and start acting like a team.
Then, management (the ones with the purse strings) needs to understand the following...
A famous fire fighter by the name of Red Adair said, "If you think its expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." You folks either need some serious training or you need to hire someone that is and you need to do it sooner than later. You're just not going to get the help you currently need from a forum.
Training doesn't have to be expensive money-wise. Training will ALWAYS be expensive time-wise. You can get a whole lot of free training by reading Grant's book on execution plans, which covers a whole lot more than just execution plans. But, again, someone is going to have to spend some time. If you're company doesn't have the time for that, then you need to hire someone that already has and then listen to them!
Like I said, tough love on my part. Ignore my rant if you want... but I think it'll cost your company dearly if you do.
--Jeff Moden
Change is inevitable... Change for the better is not.
December 10, 2019 at 10:02 am
vsamantha35 wrote:We are small shop and we don't get to hire any dedicated consultant for performance tuning. Everything has to be done by us!
Thanks everyone. Forgive me if I have asked too much or hurt anyone.
Like the others, I get that. But go back and read what Lynn wrote and understand why some of us are a bit concerned. It doesn't look like anyone in your shop is actually trying (and there's a reason for that... read on). Worse, you've posted just about everything anyone could need to figure this out (except missing almost all the DDL for the tables and indexes), which means you know how to do at least that, and yet your shop has made no demonstrable attempts on it's own to fix this (again, there's a reason for that... read on).
I'm not so much concerned about this particular query. I'm not even so much concerned about the questions you've asked on behalf of your company, so far.
Judging from this question and others that you've recently asked, what I'm concerned about is that you good folks are using a tool that you apparently know very little about and have virtually no one that understands even the basics of writing queries never mind tuning queries or even designing tables/indexes and so I'm actually concerned for the company all of you are working for. If you don't get someone that understands how to do these things, you have a going-out-of-business plan for the company. And, no... none of you are going to learn this stuff overnight and you're certainly not going to learn what you need to learn to support your company from even the best recommendations or examples on this or any other forum. You need some training or someone that already is.
And, no... this is not meant as a personal slam. We're dealing with simple facts here and you folks need a better plan. This is "tough love" coming from someone that has seen companies crash and burn because they thought they could handle things on their own but couldn't and I don't want to see you folks go through that.
Well, ok... there is a bit of a personal slam I want to make. You guys are fighting amongst yourselves but you're all stupid when it comes to SQL. Realize that and stop your fighting. If you want the Developers to write better SQL, someone has to train them or they have to have the gumption to train themselves. Apparently the DBA team there doesn't have the licks for it, either, and could strongly benefit from some training or someone developing a little gumption on their own. You folks need to stop fighting each other and realize all of that and start acting like a team.
Then, management (the ones with the purse strings) needs to understand the following...
A famous fire fighter by the name of Red Adair said, "If you think its expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." You folks either need some serious training or you need to hire someone that is and you need to do it sooner than later. You're just not going to get the help you currently need from a forum.
Training doesn't have to be expensive money-wise. Training will ALWAYS be expensive time-wise. You can get a whole lot of free training by reading Grant's book on execution plans, which covers a whole lot more than just execution plans. But, again, someone is going to have to spend some time. If you're company doesn't have the time for that, then you need to hire someone that already has and then listen to them!
Like I said, tough love on my part. Ignore my rant if you want... but I think it'll cost your company dearly if you do.
+1000
Well stated Jeff. I've been there. I've been programming T-SQL for 20+ years and it has taken training, R&D and dedication to get where I am today and yes I am still training, doing R&D and most importantly learning.
Far away is close at hand in the images of elsewhere.
Anon.
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