Dude, Your Fly is Open

  • Comments posted to this topic are about the item Dude, Your Fly is Open

    Tim Mitchell, Microsoft Data Platform MVP
    Data Warehouse and ETL Consultant
    TimMitchell.net | @Tim_Mitchell | Tyleris.com
    ETL Best Practices

  • Nice comparison with zipper and bad code, decisions etc.

    I agree Tim, none of us are perfect, so in the event of a "not on purpose" mistake, or even if anything we do, could

    be done better or improved, why not? Essentially we are all on the same team, and no one should have a team member

    make mistakes.

    There is no shame in taking advice, especially if it's good advice!

    Watching someone make a mistake, and leaving it, is on you.

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    This thing is addressing problems that dont exist. Its solution-ism at its worst. We are dumbing down machines that are inherently superior. - Gilfoyle

  • Thanks Tim. This was a nice reminder on accepting and owning up to a mistake. It is not a pleasant situation to need to discuss a mistake with somebody, but must be done from time to time.

    Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
    _______________________________________________
    I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
    SQL RNNR
    Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
    Learn Extended Events

  • Absolutely agree, much better to hear from someone quietly that you've made a blooper and even though that initial conversation can (and prob will) be awkward it is perfectly possible that it can lead to a fruitful professional friendship.

    btw, if anyone has spotted any of my bloopers, please e-mail me quietly 🙂

    John

    Assumption is the mother of all F***ups

  • Agree totally with the editorial. Constructive criticism is almost always the right thing to do, and if it's not appreciated then at least you know you did the right thing.

    I'll also suggest a good rule of thumb (closely linked with Tim's point) is to criticise privately and congratulate publicly.

    IMHO, of course....

    Semper in excretia, suus solum profundum variat

  • some good points Tim, and perhaps a timely reminder for anyone suffering from 'forum fatigue'.

    there will of course always be people who cannot accept having their points clarified, let alone criticised.

    question, how would you privately correct someone on a public forum like SSC without leaving bad information out there to trip up someone coming along later?

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  • In the right environment, a public correction can have a great deal of benefit for many. It attempts to dispel urban myths and encourages open debate. Obviously, this is different from the "zipper issue" where being discrete is everything.

    Adults, particularly professionals, need to differentiate between when it is beneficial for a wider audience and when it isn't.

    Gaz

    -- Stop your grinnin' and drop your linen...they're everywhere!!!

  • Everyone can make bad decisions but what I find most annoying is when you in private talk to the person about it and he refuses to take responsibility for it and dose nothing about it. Very annoying and unprofessional. Having that happen is perhaps not very common but it's very bad and annoying.

  • Great article. Nicely done about a difficult topic. You should work in HR.

  • Good analogy.

    I use all three, depending on the circumstances.

    There have been times where I judged the error just needed to be fixed and nothing really needed to be said, so I did so.

    There have been times where I felt a private communication (via whatever medium) was appropriate, so I did that.

    And there have been times where I've called the person out publicly. I only resort to that when I feel that not doing so will cause more damage than doing so, or where I'm calling someone out for publicly berating another undeservedly.

    - Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
    Property of The Thread

    "Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon

  • Scott Smith health care consultant (2/25/2010)


    ... You should work in HR.

    In that case, I retract the entire article :hehe:

    Tim Mitchell, Microsoft Data Platform MVP
    Data Warehouse and ETL Consultant
    TimMitchell.net | @Tim_Mitchell | Tyleris.com
    ETL Best Practices

  • majorbloodnock (2/25/2010)


    Agree totally with the editorial. Constructive criticism is almost always the right thing to do, and if it's not appreciated then at least you know you did the right thing.

    I'll also suggest a good rule of thumb (closely linked with Tim's point) is to criticise privately and congratulate publicly.

    IMHO, of course....

    I completely agree here, especially for managers.

  • Very nice editorial, Tim, and I'll respond before I head out for a much needed break today.

    Whether it's business communication, or posting here on the forum, I think small errors can be brought to someone's attention when you notice them. Not to embarass, but to clarify or help them. If it's more embarassing, or the person might take offense, I think a private attempt to discuss it with them ought to be made. If that doesn't work, then like with security vulnerabilities, I think they might need a (more) public discussion.

    The other important thing is to recognize that you might not be right. Go into the constructive criticism with the knowledge that you are expressing how you feel, and could possibly be wrong yourself. Give the other person the chance to defend themselves and be as willing to listen to them as you would like them to be for you.

  • Sometimes a public unveiling of a mistake is appropriate. For instance, when a team is meeting on a design and someone suggests something that is entirely inappropriate for the application. That is the time to nip the error in the bud. However, one can still be nice about it. That's where diplomacy comes in. And, it's also a great time to educate why the idea is bad to begin with.

    I once knew a fellow who would laugh hysterically when someone made a comment or asked a question he thought was stupid. He didn't last long in a team environment.

    Most of the folks answering questions on SSC are polite and nice but there are some that could use some humility and patience. The same goes for those asking the questions.

    I have been retitcent to post questions and answers here mainly because I risk being taken to the woodshed publicly.

    I really appreciate everyone who does volunteer their time here answering questions and creating QOtD's. It's helped me over the last couple of years learning SQL Server on the job.

  • Very good article Tim.

    majorbloodnock (2/25/2010)


    I'll also suggest a good rule of thumb (closely linked with Tim's point) is to criticise privately and congratulate publicly.

    and might I add to the congratulate publicly... and often.

    The other important thing is to recognize that you might not be right.

    How does that concept work? 😉

    Seriously, that does bring up that you need to pause to ensure that you are right before telling someone else that they are wrong.

    Wayne
    Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server 2008
    Author - SQL Server T-SQL Recipes


    If you can't explain to another person how the code that you're copying from the internet works, then DON'T USE IT on a production system! After all, you will be the one supporting it!
    Links:
    For better assistance in answering your questions
    Performance Problems
    Common date/time routines
    Understanding and Using APPLY Part 1 & Part 2

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