RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
Vila Restal (7/12/2013)
RobertYoung (7/11/2013)
Vila Restal (7/11/2013)
If the analogy is between a software shop and a band then I wouldn't say DBA's are on stage. The sales reps and support are the performers, the developers are the songwriters (and often performers too). DBA's would be behind-the-scenes people: sound or lighting engineers or even roadies.And that's the DBA who just runs the flatfiles that make the coders happy. Not the sort of DBA that most people who do RDMBS want to be.
I don't see why you would say that.
Because, as I said originally, there are multiple types of DBA, and what you describe is the code-centric data DBA under the thumb of coders. No real DBA, who's learned Codd and SQL and ..., has any desire to kowtow to coders, who generally make more bugs than features.:-P Building an Organic Normal Form™ schema isn't something that one guy/gal does over lunch, while the coders are playing frisbee. It's real work, with real payoff. That payoff being smaller data footprint, and loads less code on the client. Aye, matey, thar's the rub. Coders never want to hear about a tech that makes less code.
Again, for those coders who just want a simplified I/O syntax, and are too lazy to write their own I/O handlers, and want easy backups, then a sql database will do that. But it won't be very efficient, and will end up with spaghetti everywhere.
OK, so you've shown that you don't like coders and that DBA's mustn't be subservient to them but not why the 'DBA is more like a Sound Engineer rather than Guitarist' point is wrong. If you're going to say I'm wrong on that point, which is what you are doing (it's all I said), please explain why and not just explain that DBA's mustn't work for the coders, which isn't what I said and is another point entirely.
And why this tirade against coders? Where did you get the impression that I was suggesting a DBA's work was easy or unimportant? Do you understand what a sound engineer does? That was the title of the article: Hiring Guitarists. My point is simply that a company hiring a good DBA is more like a band hiring a good sound engineer rather than a guitarist.
It is annoying to have someone disagree with you and then give complete non-sequitur reasons for it:
RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
what you describe is the code-centric data DBA under the thumb of coders.
No it isn't. Not my intention or my opinion or what I did.
RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
No real DBA, who's learned Codd and SQL and ..., has any desire to kowtow to coders, who generally make more bugs than features.:-P
Codd's rules take 10 minutes to learn and a good DBA or developer learns them from first principle (would come to them by their own reasoning) not by wrote.
All DBAs have learnt SQL surely (of one flavour or another).
I've not learnt "..." though. Is it useful for being a DBA?
Surely no human being with any self-respect has any desire to kowtow to anyone else. The DBA/coder subset is no different.
(And wow! You really don't like "coders" do you?)
RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
Building an Organic Normal Form schema isn't something that one guy/gal does over lunch
Sounds more like development than administration to me but ok, let's call him a DBA for sake of argument
RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
t's real work, with real payoff.
I never said it wasn't
RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
That payoff being smaller data footprint, and loads less code on the client. Aye, matey, thar's the rub.
Well duh. Relational databases are better. I agree and I never said they weren't.
RobertYoung (7/12/2013)
Coders never want to hear about a tech that makes less code.
Again, for those coders who just want a simplified I/O syntax, and are too lazy to write their own I/O handlers, and want easy backups, then a sql database will do that. But it won't be very efficient, and will end up with spaghetti everywhere.
That's a sweeping generalisation of 'coders' (or perhaps more respectfully called software engineers or developers). Do you really have so little respect for them all, even those you've never met, or just the ones you've ever worked with?
To everyone else: am I being trolled here? ("I'll just quote some random guy, say I'm disagreeing with him and go into a tirade against coders")