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Are the posted questions getting worse? Expand / Collapse
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Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 9:25 PM


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Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Paul White (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.

The only possible reason is so you can say your indexes are SeXI.


That and to give manufacturers the incentive to make even larger and faster storage devices, CPUs, switches, routers, interfaces, and backup devices.


Don't forget the need for fiber between every endpoint.




Jason AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
I have given a name to my pain...
MCM SQL Server


SQL RNNR

Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw
Posting Data Etiquette - Jeff Moden
Hidden RBAR - Jeff Moden
VLFs and the Tran Log - Kimberly Tripp
Post #1428366
Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 9:28 PM


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SQLRNNR (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Paul White (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.

The only possible reason is so you can say your indexes are SeXI.


That and to give manufacturers the incentive to make even larger and faster storage devices, CPUs, switches, routers, interfaces, and backup devices.


Don't forget the need for fiber between every endpoint.


I try to make sure there's enough fiber in my diet to avoid any clogs between my endpoints.



My mantra: No loops! No CURSORs! No RBAR! Hoo-uh!

My thought question: Have you ever been told that your query runs too fast?

My advice:
INDEXing a poor-performing query is like putting sugar on cat food. Yeah, it probably tastes better but are you sure you want to eat it?
The path of least resistance can be a slippery slope. Take care that fixing your fixes of fixes doesn't snowball and end up costing you more than fixing the root cause would have in the first place.


Need to UNPIVOT? Why not CROSS APPLY VALUES instead?
Since random numbers are too important to be left to chance, let's generate some!
Learn to understand recursive CTEs by example.
Splitting strings based on patterns can be fast!
Post #1428368
Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 9:31 PM


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SQLRNNR (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Paul White (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.

The only possible reason is so you can say your indexes are SeXI.


That and to give manufacturers the incentive to make even larger and faster storage devices, CPUs, switches, routers, interfaces, and backup devices.


Don't forget the need for fiber between every endpoint.

And remember that XML is the native format for SOAP, and at the time it was introduced it was just GREAT!

Of course, now I am defining the interfaces as JSON.
Post #1428370
Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 9:55 PM


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Revenant (3/7/2013)
SQLRNNR (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Paul White (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.

The only possible reason is so you can say your indexes are SeXI.


That and to give manufacturers the incentive to make even larger and faster storage devices, CPUs, switches, routers, interfaces, and backup devices.


Don't forget the need for fiber between every endpoint.

And remember that XML is the native format for SOAP, and at the time it was introduced it was just GREAT!

Of course, now I am defining the interfaces as JSON.


YUCK




Jason AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
I have given a name to my pain...
MCM SQL Server


SQL RNNR

Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw
Posting Data Etiquette - Jeff Moden
Hidden RBAR - Jeff Moden
VLFs and the Tran Log - Kimberly Tripp
Post #1428377
Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 11:14 PM


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Me thinks we may have had an epiphany.


Lynn Pettis

For better assistance in answering your questions, click here
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For Running Totals and its variations, click here or when working with partitioned tables
For more about Tally Tables, click here
For more about Cross Tabs and Pivots, click here and here
Managing Transaction Logs

SQL Musings from the Desert Fountain Valley SQL (My Mirror Blog)
Post #1428403
Posted Friday, March 8, 2013 4:06 AM


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SQLRNNR (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Paul White (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.

The only possible reason is so you can say your indexes are SeXI.


That and to give manufacturers the incentive to make even larger and faster storage devices, CPUs, switches, routers, interfaces, and backup devices.

Don't forget the need for fiber between every endpoint.

No, fibre's not fast enough to cope with verbose nonsense like XML - just ensure that the signal path between each pair of nodes (not just endpoints, switches and routers too) in the network is good empty vacuum - light's faster in vacuum than in fibre.


Tom
Post #1428501
Posted Friday, March 8, 2013 10:41 AM


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Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Revenant (3/4/2013)
Evil Kraig F (3/4/2013)
Revenant (3/4/2013)
I always find it frustrating when someone asks me or someone else to do things for which T-SQL was not meant, in this case parsing multilevel XML with multiple occurrences of the same tag, yet prohibits use of a tool that would make it a breeze - in this case XML LINQ via CLR Integration.


Sorry Revenant. Don't mean to be the cause of your frustration in this case. Clean CLR isn't what scares my DBA's, it's letting my app coders loose with it.

It was not meant at you, Craig. I have been in that situation and I know how it feels.


I feel the same way... I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.


Well I'd say XML would be like a lot of other items -it's a tool in the arsenal. Use it correctly and it can be VERY useful; use it badly or in the wrong context, and it blows up in your face.

Kind of like any other tool.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part...unless you're my manager...or a director and above...or a really loud-spoken end-user..All right - what was my emergency again?
Post #1428698
Posted Friday, March 8, 2013 8:28 PM


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SQLRNNR (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Paul White (3/7/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.

The only possible reason is so you can say your indexes are SeXI.


That and to give manufacturers the incentive to make even larger and faster storage devices, CPUs, switches, routers, interfaces, and backup devices.


Don't forget the need for fiber between every endpoint.


I'm getting old. That now has a double meaning for me.


--Jeff Moden
"RBAR is pronounced "ree-bar" and is a "Modenism" for "Row-By-Agonizing-Row".

First step towards the paradigm shift of writing Set Based code:
Stop thinking about what you want to do to a row... think, instead, of what you want to do to a column."

(play on words) "Just because you CAN do something in T-SQL, doesn't mean you SHOULDN'T." --22 Aug 2013

Helpful Links:
How to post code problems
How to post performance problems
Post #1428836
Posted Friday, March 8, 2013 8:45 PM


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Matt Miller (#4) (3/8/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Revenant (3/4/2013)
Evil Kraig F (3/4/2013)
Revenant (3/4/2013)
I always find it frustrating when someone asks me or someone else to do things for which T-SQL was not meant, in this case parsing multilevel XML with multiple occurrences of the same tag, yet prohibits use of a tool that would make it a breeze - in this case XML LINQ via CLR Integration.


Sorry Revenant. Don't mean to be the cause of your frustration in this case. Clean CLR isn't what scares my DBA's, it's letting my app coders loose with it.

It was not meant at you, Craig. I have been in that situation and I know how it feels.


I feel the same way... I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.


Well I'd say XML would be like a lot of other items -it's a tool in the arsenal. Use it correctly and it can be VERY useful; use it badly or in the wrong context, and it blows up in your face.

Kind of like any other tool.


I strongly agree with the "right tool" sentiment. I just don't agree that XML is the right tool for the transmittal of data destined for a relational database. It seems like using a 100 ton crane to turn a monkey wrench especially when it's used to transmit otherwise flat data for a single database entity. Since I'm mostly a data troll, I've not read up on JSON but if it's a markup language that requires description tags for each row or each element, I'm not going to be very happy with that for data transmission, either.


--Jeff Moden
"RBAR is pronounced "ree-bar" and is a "Modenism" for "Row-By-Agonizing-Row".

First step towards the paradigm shift of writing Set Based code:
Stop thinking about what you want to do to a row... think, instead, of what you want to do to a column."

(play on words) "Just because you CAN do something in T-SQL, doesn't mean you SHOULDN'T." --22 Aug 2013

Helpful Links:
How to post code problems
How to post performance problems
Post #1428838
Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 7:11 AM


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Jeff Moden (3/8/2013)
Matt Miller (#4) (3/8/2013)
Jeff Moden (3/7/2013)
Revenant (3/4/2013)
Evil Kraig F (3/4/2013)
Revenant (3/4/2013)
I always find it frustrating when someone asks me or someone else to do things for which T-SQL was not meant, in this case parsing multilevel XML with multiple occurrences of the same tag, yet prohibits use of a tool that would make it a breeze - in this case XML LINQ via CLR Integration.


Sorry Revenant. Don't mean to be the cause of your frustration in this case. Clean CLR isn't what scares my DBA's, it's letting my app coders loose with it.

It was not meant at you, Craig. I have been in that situation and I know how it feels.


I feel the same way... I just can't understand why anyone would actually use XML.


Well I'd say XML would be like a lot of other items -it's a tool in the arsenal. Use it correctly and it can be VERY useful; use it badly or in the wrong context, and it blows up in your face.

Kind of like any other tool.


I strongly agree with the "right tool" sentiment. I just don't agree that XML is the right tool for the transmittal of data destined for a relational database. It seems like using a 100 ton crane to turn a monkey wrench especially when it's used to transmit otherwise flat data for a single database entity. Since I'm mostly a data troll, I've not read up on JSON but if it's a markup language that requires description tags for each row or each element, I'm not going to be very happy with that for data transmission, either.


Well in our case it's more like we're moving the 100-ton crane, dissassembling it in transit and making a whole bunch of 1-ton tractors along the way:). The XML is very useful in that, because it allows us some sane way to maintain the relations while the data is in transit, and still have some control over data types etc.... Besides - we leverage an industry-specific interchange spec which was specified using XML, so it also opens us up to all sorts of pre-made tools to help us.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part...unless you're my manager...or a director and above...or a really loud-spoken end-user..All right - what was my emergency again?
Post #1428882
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