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Steve Jones - Editor

Posted Sunday, April 05, 2009 10:28 PM

SSChampion

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Comments posted to this topic are about the item Manners

Post #690713

Lynn Pettis

Posted Sunday, April 05, 2009 10:51 PM

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Well said, both the editorial and the pod cast. From that, I really think that my blog posts are particularly relevant. For those who haven't read them, you can find them here and here.

I'll be keeping an eye on this thread. I'm especially interested to see what others think.

Cool

Lynn Pettis

For better assistance in answering your questions, click here
For tips to get better help with Performance Problems, click here
For Running Totals and its variations, click here or when working with partitioned tables
For more about Tally Tables, click here
For more about Cross Tabs and Pivots, click here and here
Managing Transaction Logs

SQL Musings from the Desert Fountain Valley SQL (My Mirror Blog)

Post #690721

Russell Shilling

Posted Sunday, April 05, 2009 11:43 PM

SSChasing Mays

Group: General Forum Members
Last Login: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:26 PM
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I've read quite a few threads that seem like the poster is a "developer" or a "programmer" who wants to be a DBA, but has no clue what to do. This is rather frustrating, but I use the advice our grandmothers gave us: "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all."

That advice works really well on the internet.

So long, and thanks for all the fish,

Russell Shilling, MCDBA, MCSA 2K3, MCSE 2K3

Post #690731

Ross Petersen

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 12:11 AM

Grasshopper

Group: General Forum Members
Last Login: Friday, November 13, 2009 7:57 PM
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Hi Steve

Yeah, I agree. It is not that hard to be civil to each other.

As a newbie, I fairly often scratch my head at some of the replies, but as you say it is reasonable that somebody posting a reply does not do free consulting per se.

Besides, if somebody such as myself has been given a few hints, then the process of figuring things out to a satisfactory conclusion will most likely result in that original poster (me) learning and understanding more in the long run than if they have a nice neat answer given to them on a platter.

Anyway, the're my thoughts on this matter.

Kind regards

Ross

Post #690740

paul.gregory

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 AM

Grasshopper

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Last Login: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 2:02 AM
Points: 12, Visits: 71

The great thing about the internet and sites like this is that when you approach your work in a generic fashion, then it is easy to write in many different languages because essentially, they nearly always work in a similar fashion. Moving from Java to C# is easy if you understand the basics. Hashtables are nearly always the same. Moving from Prolog to SQL is not too bad. C as a grouding to understand data structures, memory managment is great. So I don't need to be an expert in any given language, when moving between them, I know what I want to do and have a good idea how to do it and the internet makes it easy for me to get the syntax or refine my idea of how to solve a problem.

I learned to program a while the internet was in it's infancy. To figure out problems, you had to work at it. Nowdays, with things like Java and .Net, then as I have said before, any idiot can start programming. The discipline isn't required and lots of people are looking for the easy option. And when they come up short, then some folks get aggressive. Look at road rage. Most rages are from people who are unskilled, inconsiderate and arrogant. Blame someone else for their own problems.

Anyhow, that's my rant over with.

Post #690792

lokkers

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 2:07 AM

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Wholeheartedly agree. I've noticed an increase on a few other forums I frequent where the posters ask the simplest of questions where it is plainly obvious they haven't done a simple search of the forums or Googled for the answer. In this instance, it's sheer laziness that leads them to do it - I can't think of any other reason.

As someone who has taught themselves .NET and SQL (with the help of some great mentors, both in the flesh and on forums), I find it very frustrating that some people don't seem to make the effort to improve their own knowledge themselves - preferring it seems to "stand on the shoulders" of people kind enough to give their time and expertise for free.

Anyway, Monday morning rant over Wink

Post #690795

ST_John

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 3:31 AM

Valued Member

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Last Login: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 3:43 AM
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this 'rant' reminded me of a short piece in New Scientist a short while ago discussing why on line threads tend to get abusive more often than face to face conversations.

If you are interested it can be seen here... http://www.newscientist.com/blog/lastword/2008/07/net-rage.html

btw.
Wholehartedly agree, treat others as you would like to be treated.

Assumption is the mother of all F***ups

Post #690838

lkammer

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 3:43 AM

Valued Member

Group: General Forum Members
Last Login: Thursday, November 12, 2009 12:57 AM
Points: 50, Visits: 31

Very much agree,

It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice !! BigGrin

I started my Career with SQL being thrown in at the deep end, and without sites like this, it would have made my life a whole lot harder Smile

and i probably would not be where i am today.
(thanks to all who make these groups a reality, you really do a terrific job).

And i like the warm fuzzy feeling of helping someone who has a problem, sometimes people need a little guidance, but the bigger buzz is working it out for yourself after hitting your head off a brick wall for and finally realising why...
the sense of achievement and accomplishment is so much better, and you understand the mechanics behind it also...

Cheers

Leon

Post #690848

majorbloodnock

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 4:41 AM

Right there with Babe

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Well, I expect you'll get a lot more posts to this thread agreeing with your article, albeit (frustratingly) all from people who wouldn't commit that cardinal sin in the first place. The converted will stay converted and the unbelievers will continue in their rude and arrogant rut. Nonetheless, I still think you were right to say what you've said. Unless there's a line publicly drawn, a minority will assume that anything must, therefore, be acceptable.

However, what I think is irrelevant is the fact that almost everyone on SSC gives their time and knowledge for free. Even if they were paid for their input, I don't believe the distasteful postings would become any the less unacceptable. Whilst I appreciate the very democratic feel of the forums here, I don't feel direct enforcement of the terms and conditions is in the slightest heavy handed, and I hope you don't feel the need to justify yourself to us when you have to do it.

Semper in excretia, sumus solum profundum variat

Post #690879

peter-757102

Posted Monday, April 06, 2009 4:58 AM

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Maybe I am known to some of you to have a deep passion for arguments and a temper to match in the threads I participate in. However there are times when I feel things become too personal and out of control, I just stop then and there and don't look back.

Forums have a way of sharpening the tonge and it definatly is not like face to face talk in real life. Also it is quite easy to misinterpreted what someone is trying to convey to you when you are reading a post. This is not particular anyones fault but it helps to keep in mind the mechanics of it all and act accordingly. Assume the other is not out to redicule you, and you be right 99% of the time.

And as pointed out, a well writen post takes tons of free time. And why would someone spend so much free time just to bring it to your face? It would not make any sense at all if that was what motivates people. Just the fact people take time for you to respond and and participate in your thread should be valued highly.

And with this in mind respect is in order.

Post #690888

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