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Posted Monday, January 4, 2010 3:21 PM
SSCrazy

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Grant Fritchey (1/4/2010)
umailedit (1/4/2010)
Why should something as routine as backup not be done automatically by computers? Why depend on people to do the backup?


Speak of Murphy and he will appear. Right here is a good example. No backups. Corrupt file. Just the same as flat tire, no spare.



Backups don't save jobs but restores do. Having a corrupt backup is just like having a flat spare tire.
Post #841760
Posted Monday, January 4, 2010 5:55 PM


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GilaMonster (1/4/2010)
But why would you need a backup? I mean, it's not as if a disk will fail, or someone drops a table (or the entire database) or the data file gets corrupted or an adimn deletes the mdf accidentally or data modifed yesterday needs to be undone or ... </sarcasm>

I'm almost tired of asking people if they have backups in the 'my database is corrupt'/'I need to recover deleted <something>' forum posts. The answer 99% of the time is no. The best I ever got from someone was "I didn't know I had to take backups"

And don't get me started on the 'took a backup but never tested it and now it won't restore' situation

<sigh>


Should we be testing our backups? Should we ever really need to make sure the spare tire has air in it?


I just had to help somebody change a flat tire the other day - pulled the spare out and it was flat too.

I think, on a personal note, I would rather have my spare tire be flat than my backups be corrupt.




Jason AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
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Post #841810
Posted Tuesday, January 5, 2010 5:04 AM
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I could not agree more with the editorial and have always sort to ensure that my company’s data is protected by the best possible practice but when you work for a company whose only interest in backups is when the worst happens, then like in the film Heart Break Ridge you have to adapt and improvise.

I am constantly struggling to achieve even simple model backups because of the lack of disk storage space let alone move over to more secure complex models, and due to performance issues I am limited to doing one backup per day.

It is frightening to think that there are companies like this, but I am sure we are not alone as with everything it boils down to cost and like many many people they know they should have life, even property insurance (see some of the cases of UK flood victims) but just can’t justify the cost at the time.

Sadly, Penny wise, pound foolish.
Post #841980
Posted Tuesday, January 5, 2010 5:17 AM


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ken.trock (1/4/2010)

Speak of Murphy and he will appear. Right here is a good example. No backups. Corrupt file. Just the same as flat tire, no spare.


This is something of a sad story. Hope it works out.

I've read a lot where the final step in a backup process is to ensure you can actually restore the backup . We update our hardware frequently enough such that we do side by side updates (sometimes upgrading the SQL version too) where we restore last night's backups onto our new servers. Proof positive

Ken


Exactly. And you have a reasonable assurance that you'll be able to do a restore and that it will work in a real emergency. That's the way it should be.


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Post #841983
Posted Tuesday, January 5, 2010 5:19 AM


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Edogg (1/4/2010)
Grant Fritchey (1/4/2010)
umailedit (1/4/2010)
Why should something as routine as backup not be done automatically by computers? Why depend on people to do the backup?


Speak of Murphy and he will appear. Right here is a good example. No backups. Corrupt file. Just the same as flat tire, no spare.



Backups don't save jobs but restores do. Having a corrupt backup is just like having a flat spare tire.


100% True. But step one is still to take the backup.


----------------------------------------------------
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." Theodore Roosevelt
The Scary DBA
Author of: SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
SQL Server 2012 Query Performance Tuning
SQL Server 2008 Query Performance Tuning Distilled
and
SQL Server Execution Plans

Product Evangelist for Red Gate Software
Post #841985
Posted Tuesday, January 5, 2010 5:23 AM


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Ronald Cartmale (1/5/2010)
I could not agree more with the editorial and have always sort to ensure that my company’s data is protected by the best possible practice but when you work for a company whose only interest in backups is when the worst happens, then like in the film Heart Break Ridge you have to adapt and improvise.

I am constantly struggling to achieve even simple model backups because of the lack of disk storage space let alone move over to more secure complex models, and due to performance issues I am limited to doing one backup per day.

It is frightening to think that there are companies like this, but I am sure we are not alone as with everything it boils down to cost and like many many people they know they should have life, even property insurance (see some of the cases of UK flood victims) but just can’t justify the cost at the time.

Sadly, Penny wise, pound foolish.


My wife and I used to pay renters insurance when we lived in the city. People scoffed at us until the day we were broken into. They cleaned us out, but we were able to replace most of it because of the insurance.

I also remember having a database go corrupt, fluke thing, but we had good backups and log backups and did a point in time recovery to about a minute before the corruption occurred. We were heroes that day and just because of something incredibly fundamental and stupid easy, good, tested, backups.



----------------------------------------------------
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." Theodore Roosevelt
The Scary DBA
Author of: SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
SQL Server 2012 Query Performance Tuning
SQL Server 2008 Query Performance Tuning Distilled
and
SQL Server Execution Plans

Product Evangelist for Red Gate Software
Post #841987
Posted Tuesday, January 5, 2010 5:54 AM


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Grant Fritchey (1/5/2010)
My wife and I used to pay renters insurance when we lived in the city. People scoffed at us until the day we were broken into. They cleaned us out, but we were able to replace most of it because of the insurance.


Lucky you.

When I was broken into my insurance tried every trick in the book to avoid having to pay out (including claiming that the break in was my fault). After copious 'discussions' they eventually paid out less than half the insured value of the items, claiming 'depreciation of value'



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Post #842001
Posted Tuesday, January 5, 2010 9:45 AM


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Another thought is not backing up to the same box your db server is on :)

Email I got yesterday from a frazzled IT lead ...

We recently had a sbs2003 server running sbs2000 sql crash
It was very bad 2 of 4 Hds failed in a raid 5
I was able to run data recovery and get some sql backups which show correct file size
however when I go to restore the data to our windows 2003 std/sql2005 std server I get
backup is incorrectly formed type errors


Regards,
Kim(Kman)

www.toocoolwebs.com
Post #842189
Posted Wednesday, January 6, 2010 9:48 AM


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good editorial, and nice reminder, Grant.

When I'm with Scouts, if we're out in the woods and something breaks, you need to have things to respond to that emergency. same thing with backups and your systems. You can't count on being able to run to the store to make things all better. You had better been prepared early for what might happen.







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Post #842963
Posted Wednesday, January 6, 2010 9:51 AM


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Steve Jones - Editor (1/6/2010)
good editorial, and nice reminder, Grant.

When I'm with Scouts, if we're out in the woods and something breaks, you need to have things to respond to that emergency. same thing with backups and your systems. You can't count on being able to run to the store to make things all better. You had better been prepared early for what might happen.


Thanks Steve.

We're getting ready for the winter survival campout next month. Should be fun.


----------------------------------------------------
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." Theodore Roosevelt
The Scary DBA
Author of: SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
SQL Server 2012 Query Performance Tuning
SQL Server 2008 Query Performance Tuning Distilled
and
SQL Server Execution Plans

Product Evangelist for Red Gate Software
Post #842971
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