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Are the posted questions getting worse? Expand / Collapse
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Posted Tuesday, July 9, 2013 9:12 AM


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GilaMonster (7/9/2013)
wolfkillj (7/9/2013)
At first, I thought Gail must be psychic to know which page I was trying to link, but I'm only slightly less impressed that she thought it worth viewing the source code of the page to figure it out!


I hit 'quote' on your post.


Well, that sticks a pin in my hero-worship balloon, but thanks for pulling out the correct link anyway!


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Post #1471690
Posted Tuesday, July 9, 2013 12:02 PM


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WHAT HAPPENED TO THE FORUMS?

I go away for a couple hours and everything gets moved around! I *LIKED* the furniture where it was, my chair was in just the right spot to catch the sun in the afternoon to keep me toasty during my naps!
Post #1471773
Posted Tuesday, July 9, 2013 2:32 PM


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ok if anybody has some answers on my off the wall post here, i'd appreciate it: this is more of a "heard of an app that does this"? question:

"Throw it on the Big Screen" Like on NCIS tv show

obviously, if they can do it on a TV show, we can do it in our office.


Lowell

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Post #1471850
Posted Tuesday, July 9, 2013 2:36 PM


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L' Eomot Inversé (7/9/2013)
Koen Verbeeck (7/9/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (7/8/2013)
Koen Verbeeck (7/6/2013)
It was closed the week we were there for maintenance...


Wait. You were there for maintenance and it was closed ... so you couldn't do your maintenance?

(Grammar humor strikes again! @=)


Yeah sure, laugh with the non-native English speaker

You shouldn't tease and tweak us like that, Koen.

Given that Flemish is a Germanic language with supposedly a lot of grammar and syntax in common with English and German, and German is further from English than Flemish is, it seems interesting that only tiny changes in the English wording (apart from vocab change, of course) to get "Es war der Woche geschlossen, in denen wir dort für Wartungsarbeiten waren" in German. My German is very rusty, so I guess that may not be quite right; the tiny changes consist in moving "geschlossen" to the end of its clause, "waren" to the end of its subordinate clause and restoring the elided "for which" (in denen) that is normally omitted in informal English. I think that in informal German waren would come immediately after "dort", but my schooling was of course in formal German and my acquaintance with informal German was too long ago, so I'm playing safe. Now I can't see how the German would be interpreted any way other that the way Brandie interpreted your English, so I strongly suspect that if it were written that way in Flemish the same interpretation would be natural too. So I suspect you are pulling our leg with your non-native speaker comment. Now if I spoke Dutch that suspicion might be confirmed, or denied - but I don't even know enough Dutch to understand how smileys work in the written form of that language.
Anyway, educated Flemish and Dutch people have a great advantage over most Americans and English when interpreting written English: their knowledge of the language's vocabulary, syntax, and grammar is usually far better that that of the typical English or American university graduate, because they learn it in school; the teaching of English grammar and syntax in most schools in Britain and the USA was abandoned as being far too difficult for the poor little kiddies decades ago.


The smiley means: "OK you got me, I should've reread my sentence and cought that mistake. But since I only check for typos - my grammer is normally better than 90% of the non-native English speakers on forums like these - I usually don't catch subtle grammar mistakes. So I instead I play the 'Hey I know nothing, I'm from Barcelona' card." All in one little smiley

Given the sentence "It was closed the week we were there for maintenance", we would construct the phrase normally like this in Dutch:
"In the week we were there, it was closed for maintenance". My original sentence could also be used but it can indeed lead to grammatical confusion.

"Het was gesloten in de week dat we er waren voor onderhoud" (although more spoken language than written language)
If we really meant that we were there to do maintenance ourselves, we would say it more like this:
"Het was gesloten in de week dat we er waren om onderhoud te doen" I'm pretty sure there's a grammatical term for the difference between "voor onderhoud" en "om onderhoud te doen", like ablative or dative, but it has been way too long ago since I've dealt with grammatical cases.




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Post #1471855
Posted Tuesday, July 9, 2013 7:17 PM


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Koen Verbeeck (7/9/2013)
The smiley means: "OK you got me, I should've reread my sentence and cought that mistake. But since I only check for typos - my grammer is normally better than 90% of the non-native English speakers on forums like these - I usually don't catch subtle grammar mistakes. So I instead I play the 'Hey I know nothing, I'm from Barcelona' card." All in one little smiley

I thought it did, but I couldn't admit that while pretending it didn't, could I?

But I don't think it's a grammar mistake. I see both "in order to do maintenance" and "for maintenance" as adverb phrases (specifically adverbs of purpose) so they are grammatically the same. I think there's an issue of semantics as opposed to of grammar: "in order to do maintenance" (om ... te doen) requires that "do" have the same subject as the verb that it, as an adverb, qualifies - which, in order for that subject matching to make sense, can be a verb other than the closest one in the word order of the containing sentence; while "for maintenance" (voor ...) doesn't require that the subject of the implied verb "maintain" be specified, it's an impersonal form, so it has a strong tendency to adhere to the nearest verb. This may be less true in Dutch/Flemish than it is in English, of course - I don't claim to have any understanding of that language/those languages (help - is it politically correct to call them one language, or two?)


Tom
Post #1471909
Posted Wednesday, July 10, 2013 5:33 AM


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L' Eomot Inversé (7/9/2013)
Koen Verbeeck (7/9/2013)
The smiley means: "OK you got me, I should've reread my sentence and cought that mistake. But since I only check for typos - my grammer is normally better than 90% of the non-native English speakers on forums like these - I usually don't catch subtle grammar mistakes. So I instead I play the 'Hey I know nothing, I'm from Barcelona' card." All in one little smiley

I thought it did, but I couldn't admit that while pretending it didn't, could I?

But I don't think it's a grammar mistake. I see both "in order to do maintenance" and "for maintenance" as adverb phrases (specifically adverbs of purpose) so they are grammatically the same. I think there's an issue of semantics as opposed to of grammar:


The sentence is "It was closed the week we were there for maintenance."

The way I was taught English is the prepositional phrase modifies the phrase right before it. So the words "for maintenance" modifies "we were there" as opposed to the phrase "It was closed".

This is also the way I read it as both an author and an editor. So no, it's not really symantics here so much as an interpretation of American English grammar rules. Though I do admit that British English grammar rules may be different in regards to modification of nouns, verbs, and other phrases.


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Post #1472057
Posted Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:40 AM


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Brandie Tarvin (7/10/2013)
The way I was taught English ...


Hang on... you actually paid attention?


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Post #1472136
Posted Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:43 AM
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WayneS (7/10/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (7/10/2013)
The way I was taught English ...


Hang on... you actually paid attention?


I used to love sentence diagramming. I think it led to my love of design schematics.


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Post #1472137
Posted Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:46 AM


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WayneS (7/10/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (7/10/2013)
The way I was taught English ...


Hang on... you actually paid attention?


Not like I had a choice (see below).

Stefan Krzywicki (7/10/2013)

I used to love sentence diagramming. I think it led to my love of design schematics.


Our school district made us do sentence diagramming every freakin' year. EVERY year.


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Post #1472142
Posted Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:48 AM
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Brandie Tarvin (7/10/2013)
WayneS (7/10/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (7/10/2013)
The way I was taught English ...


Hang on... you actually paid attention?


Not like I had a choice (see below).

Stefan Krzywicki (7/10/2013)

I used to love sentence diagramming. I think it led to my love of design schematics.


Our school district made us do sentence diagramming every freakin' year. EVERY year.


Wow. I think we only did it one year.


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When you encounter a problem, if the solution isn't readily evident go back to the start and check your assumptions.
--------------------------------------
It’s unpleasantly like being drunk.
What’s so unpleasant about being drunk?
You ask a glass of water. -- Douglas Adams
Post #1472144
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