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Are the posted questions getting worse? Expand / Collapse
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Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 10:03 AM


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patrickmcginnis59 10839 (5/20/2013)
L' Eomot Inversé (5/17/2013)
patrickmcginnis59 10839 (5/15/2013)

Now can someone tell me what all the fuss is about? Please?

Not a big web user eh? Its not like people haven't been discussing this to death.

I'm not really sure how I should react to that.

You said you didn't know what all the fuss is about. I just assumed you didn't read IT related sites, ie., news sites, the sorts of websites that would discuss the pros and cons of particular products, like for instance windows 8.

Remarkable! Why would any sane speaker of English interpret it as that? I still don't know what all the fuss is about, as you certainly haven't enlightened me and neither has the vast flood of silliness posted on the web. I simply can't understand why any rational person would take the view that Windows 8 is a disaster - although people are claiming it's the biggest disaster since the invention of handed fish knives it's actually pretty harmless and nowhere near as bad as was claimed for the first release of Vista or even the first release of Windows 2000, let alone for ME (which was the second closest to justified), XP prior to SP1, NT3.5, or Windows 95 that step from Windows 3.1.1/Windows for Workgroups caused what seemed at the time to be very close to a justified storm, but looking back at where we were then and where we are now it was clearly a move in roughly the right direction).

People have indeed been discussing it to death. It appears to me to have been a discussion with much heat, little light, and far too much blind resistance to change.

Things can change for the better, things can change for the worse. Change for changes sake has its own costs, so if it doesn't bring benefits, or in windows 8's case, brings a net decrease in useability then you get all the hoopla we're seeing.

Too many such sites cover almost only (mostly imaginary) cons, because any any pro comment causes a series of silly ad-hominem attacks against its writer which deters any subsequent pro comment. As I said, too much heat and insufficient light, and a total absence of impartiality (I guess you contribute to such sites as well as here - they would like your your style very well). No decrease in usability is needed to cause such hoopla, as has been demonstrated over the decades with attacks on many other mildly innovative products.

"Blind resistance to change" is simply a casual dismissal of real people and their real preferences.

No, use of that phrase is describing what I see. Most of the hullabaloo is generated not by "real people" but by people who think they can acquire themselves a little fame by grasping this opportunity to attack Microsoft (just as equally "real people" have attacked just about every other enterprise that has ever changed its product).

edit; remove ambiguities


Tom
Post #1454610
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 10:26 AM


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Sean Lange (5/20/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (5/20/2013)

Am I the only person in the world who didn't have issues with Vista and prefer it to Windows 7?


No, my wife had no issues with Vista. She just had to have me figure out how to make it work with everything.

Neither did my wife - but she's a technophobe, and it was a switch from ME to Vista. I configured the machine and OS for her, left her an unprivileged login so she couldn't screw anything up, and let her get on with it - she was OK, but only uses it for email (rarely), Skype (rarely), writing and printing docs (rarely) and games (often) so doesn't need much. Printers no problem - but just one model, so not surprising. Mike, Camera no problems (only used for Skype). Setting it up was first time I'd used Vista - no problems there either, the only hard bit was finding the needed stuff to get a couple of very old games (one originally Windows 2, the other Dos 5) to work.

despite that, I didn't like Windows Vista - at work I reckoned it would have cost us too much effort to upgrade our client software to fit (as we had build a special locked down version of XP, playing around with things deep in the OS guts rather than just with apps - MS used to let us do that).


Tom
Post #1454622
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 10:37 AM


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Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/20/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (5/20/2013)

Am I the only person in the world who didn't have issues with Vista and prefer it to Windows 7?


Outside of MS employees? Perhaps. I didn't see it as a huge change, but I did think it had problems and was rather bloated. Win7 was a huge improvement, IMHO, in performance.


Bloated I will definitely give you. That everything was off by default (and I do mean everything) was rather annoying the first few weeks too. I had to go in and find the stuff I wanted to turn on and it wasn't always easy to find. But I didn't find it as painful as everyone else said it was. I didn't have any issues with sudden shutdowns and system freezes, etc.


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Post #1454627
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 10:46 AM


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L' Eomot Inversé (5/20/2013)

... one originally Windows 2...


Wow, someone else who remembers Windows 2.0. Second piece of software I got to write for my then-employer was for Windows 2.0. Read the entire Petzold book and went through all the code samples. Only to have to upgrade it to Windows 3.0 (yeah, 3.0, not 3.1) a month or two later. Anyhow, it taught me the Win16 API inside-out, and made me the C (yes, C, not C++) expert in the department. Remember PeekMessage, TranslateMessage, DispatchMessage etc?


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Post #1454631
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 10:48 AM


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L' Eomot Inversé (5/20/2013)
[quote]. . . (as we had build a special locked down version of XP, playing around with things deep in the OS guts rather than just with apps - MS used to let us do that).

You can still do it but you need to start from Windows Embedded. There is a bit of paperwork around it.
Post #1454632
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 11:45 AM


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Greg Edwards-268690 (5/20/2013)
Stefan Krzywicki (5/20/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (5/20/2013)
Stefan Krzywicki (5/20/2013)

I think the other thing driving annoyance over Windows 8 is that it seemed to follow Windows 7 very quickly. People were just getting used to it when 8 came along. 7 had been billed as the fix for everything wrong with Vista and it had too little time in the sun. Too much change too fast.


Am I the only person in the world who didn't have issues with Vista and prefer it to Windows 7?

That being said, I'll be upgrading to Win 8 shortly. I just hope the Win 8 upgrade I bought allows me a free 8.1 upgrade. I'd hate to spend the money twice.


I also never had any problems with Vista. I don't prefer it to Windows 7, but I don't dislike it either. I think they're around equal.


Still have a couple machines running Vista.
Had a couple of times I got bit by driver / OS updates and had to roll back.
And once had to do a boot repair.
But overall, didn't see what all the fuss was about.
In the workplace though, some software was an issue.
But that was more of a vendor and usually some of the older / unsafe programming methods.
Having to run signed drivers is a good thing.
In spite of what some users might think.

Yes, W8 to W8.1 will be free from what I have seen too.
You didn't see what all the fuss was about? Well, then you must not get on the internet ever. (how did you get your post here, did you call GeekSquad?)


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Post #1454656
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 12:41 PM
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jcrawf02 (5/20/2013)
Greg Edwards-268690 (5/20/2013)
Stefan Krzywicki (5/20/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (5/20/2013)
Stefan Krzywicki (5/20/2013)

I think the other thing driving annoyance over Windows 8 is that it seemed to follow Windows 7 very quickly. People were just getting used to it when 8 came along. 7 had been billed as the fix for everything wrong with Vista and it had too little time in the sun. Too much change too fast.


Am I the only person in the world who didn't have issues with Vista and prefer it to Windows 7?

That being said, I'll be upgrading to Win 8 shortly. I just hope the Win 8 upgrade I bought allows me a free 8.1 upgrade. I'd hate to spend the money twice.


I also never had any problems with Vista. I don't prefer it to Windows 7, but I don't dislike it either. I think they're around equal.


Still have a couple machines running Vista.
Had a couple of times I got bit by driver / OS updates and had to roll back.
And once had to do a boot repair.
But overall, didn't see what all the fuss was about.
In the workplace though, some software was an issue.
But that was more of a vendor and usually some of the older / unsafe programming methods.
Having to run signed drivers is a good thing.
In spite of what some users might think.

Yes, W8 to W8.1 will be free from what I have seen too.
You didn't see what all the fuss was about? Well, then you must not get on the internet ever. (how did you get your post here, did you call GeekSquad?)

LOL Geeksquad, that would explain everything!

EDIT:OK OK I'm just kidding! I'm sure GeekSquad is a perfectly fine place to get your computer fixed!!!!!
Post #1454688
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 12:51 PM


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jcrawf02 (5/20/2013)
Greg Edwards-268690 (5/20/2013)
Stefan Krzywicki (5/20/2013)
Brandie Tarvin (5/20/2013)
Stefan Krzywicki (5/20/2013)

I think the other thing driving annoyance over Windows 8 is that it seemed to follow Windows 7 very quickly. People were just getting used to it when 8 came along. 7 had been billed as the fix for everything wrong with Vista and it had too little time in the sun. Too much change too fast.


Am I the only person in the world who didn't have issues with Vista and prefer it to Windows 7?

That being said, I'll be upgrading to Win 8 shortly. I just hope the Win 8 upgrade I bought allows me a free 8.1 upgrade. I'd hate to spend the money twice.


I also never had any problems with Vista. I don't prefer it to Windows 7, but I don't dislike it either. I think they're around equal.


Still have a couple machines running Vista.
Had a couple of times I got bit by driver / OS updates and had to roll back.
And once had to do a boot repair.
But overall, didn't see what all the fuss was about.
In the workplace though, some software was an issue.
But that was more of a vendor and usually some of the older / unsafe programming methods.
Having to run signed drivers is a good thing.
In spite of what some users might think.

Yes, W8 to W8.1 will be free from what I have seen too.
You didn't see what all the fuss was about? Well, then you must not get on the internet ever. (how did you get your post here, did you call GeekSquad?)


I must remember everything I read on the internet is true.
And I don't every remember having to call the Geek Squad for anything.
Post #1454690
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 12:55 PM


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Greg Edwards-268690 (5/20/2013)

I must remember everything I read on the internet is true.


I'm a French model! Bon-jury.


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Post #1454692
Posted Monday, May 20, 2013 1:10 PM


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Revenant (5/20/2013)
L' Eomot Inversé (5/20/2013)
[quote]. . . (as we had build a special locked down version of XP, playing around with things deep in the OS guts rather than just with apps - MS used to let us do that).

You can still do it but you need to start from Windows Embedded. There is a bit of paperwork around it.

Yes, at Neos International I was in charge of all software licensing and related paperwork in the UK (including licensing for international onwards distribution) so I went through the embedded stuff; I reckon your "a bit" is something of an understatement, although MS licensing was vastly easier to deal with than Apple licensing, although not as easy as Macromedia, Adobe, HP - and Chrystal Reports licensing was a really pleasant surprise. I also did some "come and play with it " courses in 2007/2008 - in some respects it was a far better starting point and in some ways a poorer one than trying to do it with the customisation features in XP Pro (which allowed you to replace the shell with your own, for example, more easily than you could do that in windows embedded, at least until quite recently). Our new Lebanon team were in the process of switching over to embedded (and pretty near finished) when I left the company, and they had already taken over some of the international software licensing issues (I hope they picked up the rest) so Beirut was dealing with the paperwork there (and some of the oddities of cross-country licensing from MS are almost enough to drive one insane).


Tom
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