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Posted Tuesday, February 26, 2008 2:28 PM
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Nice Steve! The problem with being an INTJ (personal experience) is that by the time you've done th TJ part, the world has passed you by, you're missing a dynamic, a dimension, if you will. Einstein was certainly an INTJ...did he regret E=MC^2...no...did he know at the instance of the "Aha!" that his work would launch a destructive force that would (and still) threatens the existance of mankind....."no", I think is the answer. We have a tendency to want to put people and there personalities in a "box", type this or type that....I think we all are many types throughout our lives and often concurrently...I thinks its still important to believe in people and their infinite capability to contribute and not to write them off in an instant based on cultural temporariness archetypes...
Post #460562
Posted Tuesday, February 26, 2008 2:59 PM
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Hmmm....Steve. The Wiki article you linked to clearly says:

"The neutrality of this article is disputed.
Please see the discussion on the talk page.(December 2007)
Please do not remove this message until the dispute is resolved."

Linking to a disputed Wiki page is a bit lazy don't you think? Your standards are usually higher. Tight deadline?



James Stover, McDBA
Post #460576
Posted Tuesday, February 26, 2008 4:25 PM
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I am ISTJ. I did this test because there were 12 of us working on a project and we argued about everything everyday. So my manager made all of us took the test and then a mediator came in to help us to understand how to work together for example, how the 'I' people worked with the 'E' people. It was a fun class. After that we continued to argue.
:)

I did one test for another company so my manager could understand my working style and another test to show how the manager could help to get the whole group working together. The company even hired the consultants coming in to help us going through the materials. The test result was quite accurate but it did not help anything. The manager still could not motivate the team and helped the team members. I did not know why the company spent all these money for.

So as far as I concern, the test is fun but it is totally useless !:D:P
Post #460607
Posted Tuesday, February 26, 2008 4:38 PM


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majorbloodnock

Isn't the 19th century when psychiatry came into being with people like Freud?




Lynn Pettis

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Posted Tuesday, February 26, 2008 5:07 PM


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The Wiki page was a good explanation and overview. I don't know where the dispute is, but it's a valid reference and easier to read than a few others I found.

And a somewhat tight deadline :)







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Post #460616
Posted Wednesday, February 27, 2008 12:24 AM
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Another thing: the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator is based on, and inspired by, the work done on this by Carl Jung. His interest was firstly to try to find explanations for the differences in behaviour of different people. It was also part of his entire life's work which was aimed at providing a framework in which people could reach their ultimate potential: to help people to become the person they were "intended" to be.

So he definitely wouldn't go along with people using his personality types to box people in and limit them. In fact, part of his thesis was that as we mature in life (if we really are maturing and not just getting older), we take on more and more of our undeveloped characteristics. In particular, as an INTJ, I should find that the E, S, F and P aspects of my personality (which are the relatively undeveloped bits) will become more prominent.

Another personality typing instrument, the Enneagram, also has as its aim the growth of the individual into a more rounded personality. I heard it once said, "The Enneagram doesn't put you in a box, it shows you the box you've always been in, and gives you a way to get out". I think the same would apply to Jung/Myers-Briggs.
Post #460707
Posted Wednesday, February 27, 2008 1:26 AM


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Lynn Pettis (2/26/2008)
majorbloodnock

Isn't the 19th century when psychiatry came into being with people like Freud?



He, he. Yes, indeed.

And with that line of analysis came a whole lot more pigeonholes. Don't get me wrong, I agree with what's being said here about the value of knowing yourself and recognising patterns and characteristics in others. The trouble is that spotting similarities is one thing, but extrapolating it to classify people is quite another. As soon as you say "you're a type A", what you're also saying is "you're NOT a type B", even though, in reality, there may be quite a lot of overlap. The tendency is regrettably to focus on differences rather than similarities, and that can be devisive (and is, of course, part of the reason quite a few of these tests are not recommended as part of a hiring decision).

If we look around, it's quite amazing the number of ways in which people manage to develop a "them and us" attitude, and it can cause immense divisions and prejudices (I'm white, you're black. I'm British, you're foreign. I'm male, you're female. I'm Christian, you're Muslim. I support this football team, you don't. I'm straight, you're gay. I'm well off, you're poor. etc. etc.). My mistrust of classifications such as these is not in their accuracy so much as in how most lay people interpret them.


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Post #460715
Posted Wednesday, February 27, 2008 6:34 AM


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The company I work for puts us through a variety of tests, either administered by HR or through classes with the managers. Unfortunately, I don't know them all. One of them was social styles. It defines quadrants & then subdivides the quadrants again. You fall into Driver, Amiable, Expressive or Analytical. Then it's divided again. The splits are Task Directed, Analytical & Driver, or People Directed, Amiable & Expressive, and then Tell Directed, Driver & Expressive or Ask Directed, Analytical & Amiable. I came out a Driver-Driver, which makes my co-workers insane since most of them are Analyticals (not polar opposites, but definately pulled in different directions). They put us through this, not to help us understand ourselves, but to help us understand how to better communicate with our co-workers. When you can remember what to do with the information, it really can help. It's remember that you can't just TELL the bloody damned analytics to fix a problem, but rather ASK them to investigate the problem. Makes me nuts. "Servers down, FIX IT!" or "Hey, if you have the time today, it seems the server might be down, could you look into it please" BLEH!

I took the other one, came up INTJ whatever that means.


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Post #460822
Posted Wednesday, February 27, 2008 7:26 AM


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Peter Tuffin (2/27/2008)
Another thing: the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator is based on, and inspired by, the work done on this by Carl Jung. His interest was firstly to try to find explanations for the differences in behaviour of different people. It was also part of his entire life's work which was aimed at providing a framework in which people could reach their ultimate potential: to help people to become the person they were "intended" to be.

So he definitely wouldn't go along with people using his personality types to box people in and limit them. In fact, part of his thesis was that as we mature in life (if we really are maturing and not just getting older), we take on more and more of our undeveloped characteristics. In particular, as an INTJ, I should find that the E, S, F and P aspects of my personality (which are the relatively undeveloped bits) will become more prominent.

Another personality typing instrument, the Enneagram, also has as its aim the growth of the individual into a more rounded personality. I heard it once said, "The Enneagram doesn't put you in a box, it shows you the box you've always been in, and gives you a way to get out". I think the same would apply to Jung/Myers-Briggs.


...which goes to highlight what worries me most about these kinds of tests: people with only the foggiest idea of the purpose for these, reading results they don't understand, and making assessments/judgments they can't/shouldn't make based on said results.

All due respect - but an HR department performing these kinds of tests means they intend to use them for something. Unless there's a doctor of psychology on the staff - it's likely to be used VERY incorrectly.


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Post #460872
Posted Wednesday, February 27, 2008 9:38 AM
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Matt Miller (2/27/2008)

...which goes to highlight what worries me most about these kinds of tests: people with only the foggiest idea of the purpose for these, reading results they don't understand, and making assessments/judgments they can't/shouldn't make based on said results.

All due respect - but an HR department performing these kinds of tests means they intend to use them for something. Unless there's a doctor of psychology on the staff - it's likely to be used VERY incorrectly.


I concur, Matt, with both your points. It's been a long time (thankfully) since I've been subjected to Myers-Briggs or whatever the one with the quadrants is named. In each case, it was either an attempt by management to make a group act as a team that could never, ever act in concert due to their preoccupation with backstabbing, or an attempt by HR to look busy.

The thing that always struck me as a basic inaccuracy about these tests was they are self-assessments. So if you saw yourself as analytical, generous, non-judgmental, and heroic, that's what the test said, even if you were flaccid, selfish, venal, and dumber than a bag of hammers. But then we were supposed to deal with you according to your Myers-Briggs letters, which were helpfully posted by your desk. I just couldn't deal with it.



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