InstantForum.NET v2.9.0SQLServerCentralhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/notifications@sqlservercentral.comThu, 24 May 2012 13:14:54 GMT20http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxHere are 2 real life stories; both while working at the same company as DBA.1. I was asked by a project manager (via email) at a telco company to give a listing of customer information to her so she could create a small phone book for asome bridge club or something to sell as a fundraiser. I knew this was not allowed by government regulations. Of course, I stated that I could not give the information she sought for the reasons she should already know. The next week, a developer came to me to ask how to join to get some specific address information from one of our databases. I knew exactly where the request had come from and proceeded to book a meeting to get the issue resolved. After the meeting, I send out minutes and asked everyone to respond that they understood this information could not be given out for that specific purpose. I then went back and forwarded all of the email threads and meeting minutes and responses to my personal email account (gmail).About 3 months later i was asked by a new BA to provide complete address information for customers in a very specific geographical region because engineering was doing an inventory of specific hardware at addresses in this region. All of the requests were done via email and I sent very detailed questions about exact data needed; all the responses were very clear. I created the reports and shipped off to the BA for approval. 4 weeks later, I got a very panicked call from a certain project manager asking me why I provided such detailed address information for the phone book she created. I kind of chuckled then proceeded to scour my email in and outboxes for those emails from the BA about the inventory check report and sent those to my gmail account as well.The PM promptly told our CEO, CFO, and everyone she could email how it was my fault for providing the information, which she didn't even look at before sending to the community group to make the phone book. I was being gunned for by everyone in my company until I whipped out the series of emails I had forwarded to my personal email accounts.Anyway, the company was fined heavily for breaking government regulations, they had to provide compensation for those customers which were supposed to have been unlisted (not a requirement for the inventory report), and i think even had to relocate a few undercover police officers whom addresses and names they listed.I was completely backed by everyone after the truth came out ands the PM was fired.2. I was asked by my boss in an email to alter a specific set of customers' billing information in one of databases. I promptly refused and, you guessed it, forwarded the email to my gmail account (with my refusal response). About, 2 months later I heard through the grapevine that there was an internal audit done on customer billing information and there were several irregularities being investigated. About 2 days after that, a little birdie who happened to be a sysadmin and my buddy, told me he "may" have been asked to delete some of my emails form the exchange server by someone he could not refuse.Anyway, I was approached by HR, CFO, and CEO about who has access pother than me, they assumed no one, had access to the databases. I knew where this was going. I went to my boss and told him what was going on and that I under no circumstances would have changed data like that, to which he responded it must have been me. The next day I had another private conversation with my boss, printed copy of the request he had made of me in hand. I never heard about it again.I quit very shortly after that.All that story to tell you same as everyone else... there are very dishonest people out there who will throw you to the wolves if it means their neck our yours. GMAIL has a large capacity and hitting the forward button is very easy to do. Use it.I don't know how anyone could work for someone like that, or company like that. if you confront your boss in a non threatening way and it was not just an innocent mistake, have some proof of your disapproval in a safe place and start your job search. Good Luck.Tue, 11 May 2010 13:45:49 GMThfxDBAhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspx[quote][b]Steve Jones - Editor (5/10/2010)[/b][hr]Some good advice here, but if your boss won't listen, I think you ought to document your care in an email, and probably writing, and send it to your boss. Cover yourself.Then I'd consider looking for another job. You can take it to your boss' boss, but that is likely to start ending your chances of continuing at that company. Maybe not, but if you go that route, I'd be prepared to move on.And despite what Jeff says, don't record a conversation if you don't have the legal right. You might get yourself into more trouble for no reason. [url]http://www.rcfp.org/taping/[/url][/quote]You always have the right to record it when someone tells you to do something wrong.Mon, 10 May 2010 11:57:59 GMTJeff Modenhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxSome good advice here, but if your boss won't listen, I think you ought to document your care in an email, and probably writing, and send it to your boss. Cover yourself.Then I'd consider looking for another job. You can take it to your boss' boss, but that is likely to start ending your chances of continuing at that company. Maybe not, but if you go that route, I'd be prepared to move on.And despite what Jeff says, don't record a conversation if you don't have the legal right. You might get yourself into more trouble for no reason. [url]http://www.rcfp.org/taping/[/url]Mon, 10 May 2010 11:13:26 GMTSteve Jones - SSC Editorhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxHeh... forget all the legalities. Strap on a recording device and tell your manager "No" because it's against the law.Mon, 10 May 2010 11:06:50 GMTJeff Modenhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxLook up whether you're in a one person taping state or not (can you lawfully record a conversation you have a speaking part in without informing the other person, or not), and if you are, evaluate if you'd like to bring a concealed audio recorder with you or not as a CYA in case of retaliation.When you talk to your manager, bring a quick estimate of how much money it would take to properly license the software, as well as what kind of technical support that buys. If you really want, bring an alternate or two that might be cheaper and provide similar functionality.But first; evaluate the corporate culture. Is violating licenses/contracts/ethics commonplace and accepted/encourages, or not?Mon, 10 May 2010 08:11:26 GMTNadrekhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxThis is a touchy situation. It may be that this is not the only software used illegaly by your company or that your manager is unaware of the license limitations.Either way, ask for a one on one meeting with your manager and bing up the issue in a discreet, private way. Do not accuse or over-react or judge the situation. Just mention that you noticed that the software cannot be used in a production environment because of license limitations and ask for directions on what to do.That is the extent of your responsibility. If you are not happy or satisfied with the manager's answers, just make up your mind if you want to continue working for the same company. Because if you do, then you have to steer away from the license topic or your manager will find out and take unfavorable actionsSun, 09 May 2010 08:00:07 GMTKingsleyTagbohttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspx[quote][b]Elliott W (11/16/2009)[/b][hr]So let me see if I got you right..Your boss has you using software outside of the license, ie you don't have a license to use it commercially but you are..That about sum it up?I see two seperate things. You should in a written manner, preferably with sent and read receipts send your boss a memo stating that the company is currently using this software out of license and that continued use could get us into trouble. Don't state anything like if you don't get a license I will turn you in but make it clear continuing as is could subject the company to sanctions that could put it out of business. As soon as it is sent copy the sent mail and any receipts to a thumb drive, you want a copy, just in case.the other item is you need to see how your boss responds, if he responds that we will continue as is, YOU need to make a decision as to what you can deal with, and if the company ever gets busted you have some cover, not sure how much.. But your boss can no longer claim he didn't know and if he does then you have proof otherwise.When this happens it makes me wonder what OTHER software they are running that they don't have valid licenses to. I know everybody wants to save money, but sometimes companies take that too far.CEWII[/quote]Absolute must do things.Best and most important thing is to talk to your boss about the issue first and openly.Tue, 23 Feb 2010 19:05:23 GMTSQLRNNRhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxi will leave the legal/ethical aspects of the situation to the other posters, as they have some good commentary, and focus on a different side of things. one of the particular problems I see from your end is the lack of 24x7 support. we use SQLSafe in our production environment, and have found it to be an excellent product - though a good bit higher in cost than Redgate's competing product. since we have licensing + maintenance, we have support through idera if/when we need it, plus upgrades whenever they come out. support for the freeware edition is only through the forums. though i don't doubt they've done a fine job on their freeware version, it would worry me to have my southbound-side on the line with no support - especially when we're talking about such a critical area as backups. whew. that would cause me endless amounts of extra unneeded heartburn. needless to say it might be worth another try at convincing them to pay out the bucks for a few licenses. if the price is a sticking point, maybe Redgate SQL backup is an alternative.tough situation. i can't tell you for sure what i'd do in your case. that's a rock and a hard place for sure.Tue, 23 Feb 2010 18:29:04 GMTmwalberthttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxA lot of good advice has been given. Please don't compromise your integrity.I certainly hope it doesn't come to this, but if you are fired for refusing to install an unlicensed product, you may have some recourse under "whistleblower" laws.Hope it's just a misunderstanding.Thu, 19 Nov 2009 09:15:36 GMTRML51http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspx[quote][b]EdVassie (11/19/2009)[/b][hr]Hence the quotes around 'confidential'...These schemes work best if your company is basically sound but your boss is cutting corners. If you make a valid complain your position should be protected, but your boss's position may be at risk.If the company just has this process as window dressing, then you could find raising a complaint is a job-shortening move. You need to be happy you can deal with whatever the consequences might be before you raise such a complaint.[/quote]Ed, my comment had nothing to do with how well the company 'confidential' process works. The boss hears that a 'confidential' complaint was made right after someone made him aware of the same issue. Unfortunately, the boss will likely think it's the same person.Thu, 19 Nov 2009 08:39:36 GMTAlvin Ramardhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxHence the quotes around 'confidential'...These schemes work best if your company is basically sound but your boss is cutting corners. If you make a valid complain your position should be protected, but your boss's position may be at risk.If the company just has this process as window dressing, then you could find raising a complaint is a job-shortening move. You need to be happy you can deal with whatever the consequences might be before you raise such a complaint.Thu, 19 Nov 2009 08:32:23 GMTEdVassiehttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspx[quote][b]EdVassie (11/19/2009)[/b][hr]I would go with Elliott and GSquared. Send your boss a mail telling him what is happening. ........Also, if your organisation has any 'confidential' process for reporting business problems consider using that to escalate the issue, but maybe only after you have got your resume into the market place.[/quote]Unfortunately, I'm sure you boss would have a very good idea who might have reported the issue via the 'confidential' process.:(Thu, 19 Nov 2009 07:29:07 GMTAlvin Ramardhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxEd,I like your response. good advice.CEWIIThu, 19 Nov 2009 07:24:46 GMTElliott Whitlowhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxI would go with Elliott and GSquared. Send your boss a mail telling him what is happening. Make clear you think this is an innocent error. Don't even mention it could put the company at risk of sanctions - your boss should realise the implications of this problem and may take your words as a threat.Keep hardcopy and electronic copies of your mail, the read receipt, and your boss's reply at home.All being well, your boss will want to get the license sorted out, and will ask you to give a statement of the costs involved to do this. Be ready to answer quickly, so no-one can say you are a cause of delays. However, don't be surprised it it takes 2 to 4 months to get budget approval and have the licenses in place.If it goes bad and you feel there is no intention of getting things legal, start looking for another job. Also, if your organisation has any 'confidential' process for reporting business problems consider using that to escalate the issue, but maybe only after you have got your resume into the market place.Thu, 19 Nov 2009 03:35:39 GMTEdVassiehttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxWell you have different options, there is nothing on the idera site about restrictions on not using the freeware version, however they no longer now offer the freeware version for download.There are massive differences in functionality between sql safe and the freeware version. first thing being $1195 per instance for example.I can only agree with the previous poster, you will hit massive issues if your entire backup/DR strategy is based on this product. the first thing you will be asked for is, your license numbers if you have to ring up for support.and make no mistake, you will be held responsible if this situation occurs. I would be very tempted to ask your boss, how do you keep your critical systems running if you need to ask for support for this product that underpins your entire database infrastructure.Wed, 18 Nov 2009 08:31:39 GMTSilverfoxhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxStart out with the assumption that it's an innocent error. Your boss may not even know it's not a licensed copy. Alert him to the issue, pointing out your concern that tech support won't be available if there's an issue. That might be enough.Keep in mind that someone may have made a mistake and not applied the license correctly during installation. Might not be an ethics/legal issue at all.If, however, it turns out that this is a known problem, and is actually being done in an effort to avoid paying a licensing fee, that's an issue. Companies that do that kind of thing, as already pointed out, are the same kind of companies that will cheat you, cheat on taxes, break OSHA regs, etc. Cover your own a**, and start job hunting ASAP.Wed, 18 Nov 2009 08:21:14 GMTGSquaredhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxIf this is the same SQL safe that I am thinking of (backup tool) then I would be more concerned with the fact that you are the trusting the safety of business-critical data to a product that is not licensed. The backups may run happily, but what happens when there is a disaster and you need to restore from one of these compressed backups and you find that your un-licensed copy does not work? you will not be able to get any help from the company.I am surprised your business is willing to take such a risk for such a relatively inexpensive product, and I am sure you will be the one left holding the can if the worst happens.Wed, 18 Nov 2009 07:42:15 GMTsteveb. http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxCan't help but chime in to agree with the excellent advice above. Boils down to "do you really want to work for someone who is doing this?"Which may only be answered by finding out if he realizes that it's happening. If your boss is willfully and knowingly violating the license agreement, then I'd say it's time to shop around for a new job.Wed, 18 Nov 2009 07:06:26 GMTjcrawf02http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxAlso note that a company that will ignore software laws in order to save money, because they can get away with it, may just as willfully ignore labor laws to save money, because they can usually get away with that, too.-EddieTue, 17 Nov 2009 18:06:27 GMTEddie Wuerchhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxSo let me see if I got you right..Your boss has you using software outside of the license, ie you don't have a license to use it commercially but you are..That about sum it up?I see two seperate things. You should in a written manner, preferably with sent and read receipts send your boss a memo stating that the company is currently using this software out of license and that continued use could get us into trouble. Don't state anything like if you don't get a license I will turn you in but make it clear continuing as is could subject the company to sanctions that could put it out of business. As soon as it is sent copy the sent mail and any receipts to a thumb drive, you want a copy, just in case.the other item is you need to see how your boss responds, if he responds that we will continue as is, YOU need to make a decision as to what you can deal with, and if the company ever gets busted you have some cover, not sure how much.. But your boss can no longer claim he didn't know and if he does then you have proof otherwise.When this happens it makes me wonder what OTHER software they are running that they don't have valid licenses to. I know everybody wants to save money, but sometimes companies take that too far.CEWIIMon, 16 Nov 2009 21:14:07 GMTElliott Whitlowhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic819769-334-1.aspxI started a permanent position with a company about a week ago. In my role I work am working with databases on SQL Server 2005 instances a great deal. My first task given to me is to create SSIS packages that calls and runs SQL Safe extended stored procedures. My manager wants to use SQL Safe because of it's benefits and the cost. Well the cost is nothing because he is using a Freeware version and deploying it to production servers. I got a copy of the version he is installing and in the license agreement during install it clearly states it isn't to be used in corporate settings. I question whether or not my manager is setting me up to see what I will do when faced with an ethical dilemma or if he can be taken at face value and totally expects to be running all of the database backups/restored/copies all from a non-licensed product? What would you do in a situation like this? BTW, this is a small IT department of 20. My manager has been with the company some 12 years and his manager 13 years. I don't think going over his head would do anything but get me fired.ThanksMon, 16 Nov 2009 19:54:18 GMTTwoSocks