InstantForum.NET v2.9.0SQLServerCentralhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/notifications@sqlservercentral.comThu, 23 May 2013 14:33:07 GMT20http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI play the Ukulele when programs are compiling or a long query is going on. (strangely enough, I seem to be able to avoid being required to be in open-office areas.) A soprano uke fits easily into a draw, and I can have it out and playing 'Lulu's back in town' or 'me and Nelly shiver like a jelly', in no time. It is an excellent way of timing things. The bootup-time for SSMS, for example, is worth up to ten bars of 'There's a body on the line'. Oddly, ever since I started the habit, several years ago, the compilation time for applications has stayed pretty constant. The old programmers used to say that compilation time was usually the time taken to roll a ciggie. (cigarette) Alas, now in these politically appropriate times, this aint allowed any more, but I reckon that this is equivalent to the time taken to play a verse of 'Every single little tingle of my heart' which means that we haven't made much progress since the sixties, despite Dual processors and fancy operating systems. (I don't play 'stairway to heaven': Who wants a soprano uke broken over your head?)Fri, 24 Oct 2008 12:28:34 GMTPhil Factorhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxForgot to mention, that for those who would like to have both IT and music together, you should try play Frets On Fire, this is the freeware version of Guitar Hero video game, but played with the Keyboard of your PC, more info @ http://fretsonfire.sourceforge.net/__JoeFri, 24 Oct 2008 12:11:53 GMTjmorrinzonhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI strongly agree with this opinion, after reading this article I asked to to some of my team members and all of them play guitar (mainly), and sax, and... all of us like to play Guitar Hero!!! YEAH!IT rocks!!Regards__JoeFri, 24 Oct 2008 12:06:40 GMTjmorrinzonhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI have to agree with this. I think there are basically two factors that play into this. One, music is basically a mathematical language that you use to create something with. As is true with computer programming. Secondly, most musicians enjoy the challenge of working something out... working on an arrangement or creating one. The same can be said about most computer programmers.I've been a musician for over 40 years and a computer programmer for over 25 years. I truly enjoy both. But, I have to admit that music is my passion. I have my BA in Music as a performance major.Thu, 22 May 2008 04:48:14 GMTkcrichards1http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxLOL, even at the time the bands I was into were not mainstream (Although Sonic Youth are still going and are sort of famous now), most people I come accross who are the same age as me, late 30's, haven't heard of these bands but it's always the people you least suspect who have. :cool:Wed, 21 May 2008 06:09:22 GMTBuxton69-502449http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]Buxton69 (5/21/2008)[/b][hr]I was in a band first for five years tyring to be a musician, it didn't work out but everyone in the band bar one now work in IT and have computer degrees, that's four of us! It was a late eighties/early nineties psychadelic punk band, we played with people like Spacemen 3, Mudhoney, Gaye Bykers on Acid, Telescopes, Terminal Cheesecake etc. It was that sort of music if any of you had heard of any of these. It was fun, wish I had made it but now my hobby is Chinese Punk bands, I set up a record label and released a couple of Chinese bands and one French band, one of them, Carsick Cars supported Dinosaur Jr last week in London and Sonic Youth last year in London, I could go on for ever about it... Buxton[/quote]I think I understand now how my users feel if ever I lapse into techie jargon. I understood every word of that post, but the sum of them made very little sense to me :ermm:No disrespect, incidentally, Buxton, just that I suspect I'm showing my age; I didn't come even close to recognising any of those band names. Seems I'm starting to sound like my parents used to....Wed, 21 May 2008 04:48:22 GMTmajorbloodnockhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI was in a band first for five years tyring to be a musician, it didn't work out but everyone in the band bar one now work in IT and have computer degrees, that's four of us! It was a late eighties/early nineties psychadelic punk band, we played with people like Spacemen 3, Mudhoney, Gaye Bykers on Acid, Telescopes, Terminal Cheesecake etc. It was that sort of music if any of you had heard of any of these. It was fun, wish I had made it but now my hobby is Chinese Punk bands, I set up a record label and released a couple of Chinese bands and one French band, one of them, Carsick Cars supported Dinosaur Jr last week in London and Sonic Youth last year in London, I could go on for ever about it... BuxtonWed, 21 May 2008 03:59:51 GMTBuxton69-502449http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI always felt odd because Jazz and Blues are my mainstay. makes me feel good to hear you all talk about music in such a way. Always wanted to learn an instrument, if it weren't for other interests I may have tried by now. Happy Sailing.Fri, 16 May 2008 12:32:53 GMTEd Salvahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI think it has to do with pattern recognition. I'm not sure if the relationship has been formally studied, but it's been recognized for a long time. 30 years ago when I taught programming at a VoTech, there were a number of potential employers who asked for the resumes of retread music majors.Fri, 16 May 2008 12:03:07 GMTbarn0230http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI used to play trumpet, but never made the correlation between the 2 skills. But in retrospect I believe there is a great deal of similarity between musical skills and IT skills.I did read many years ago that there was a statistical correlation between successful IT persons and the fact that chess and/or Science Fiction was popular with them. I can see both correlations. I used to play chess and there are definite similarities in the thought process, and I still read Science Fiction. Besides, it was a Sci/Fi book that coined the words 'matrix' and 'cyberspace'. The Sci/Fi readers will know who I am referring to.Before I began doing database work, my bent was primarily programming, and the skills I found to translate the best were some of the same ones I used as an auto mechanic and as a small engine mechanic. Troubleshooting complex hardware (like electronic ignition systems, automatic transmissions, etc) is very similar to troubleshooting balky code...except your hands are in better shape and you don't (usually) have to assume awkward positions to work.Fri, 16 May 2008 08:04:15 GMTG Bryant McClellanhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI've noticed the correlation as well. I happen to play piano. I've never really thought about why it is the case that many programmers are also musicians and vice-versa, but I'm certain there's something more to it than just coincidence. Just my two cents.Fri, 16 May 2008 07:10:35 GMTLongv-278915http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxYes, it is and a lot of great comments. Thanks for posting these kinds of inter-subject topics for this very active community.Fri, 16 May 2008 06:10:37 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxWow, quite a response. While we might not consider ourselves musicians, seems like lots of us have a guitar or something we mess around with.Thu, 15 May 2008 21:28:59 GMTSteve Jones - SSC Editorhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxThis observation is one that I have noticed as well. It is uncanny!While I am a huge fan of music (blues in particular), I have not been blessed with that talent; but despite that I still try to pluck my guitar once in a while. Having said that, I was a Graphic Art major in college.Thu, 15 May 2008 19:43:59 GMTJohn Magnaboscohttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI am a professional Classical musician now working as a DBA for a large multi-national. My predecessor was a Fine Art graduate - not sure how that ties in. Both IT and professional music have a number of requirements in common: a high degree of focus, an exceptional ability to learn, an emphasis on quality, a lot of self discipline and hard work - more than most professions. Whilst technical work may impose an "exacting rigour" at times, I doubt it is any greater than that required for high standard musical performance - in fact I suspect probably less. Not much has been said about the creative nature of IT, but this was one of the main attractions for me, especially when it comes to design, programming or problem solving. I would say the satisfaction of designing and creating from scratch a high quality system or application is as great as that gained from performing a Beethoven symphony or composing a new piece of music.Thu, 15 May 2008 16:18:26 GMTAndrew Whettamhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxMy grandfather used to play piano, violin, guitar. My mother played piano (she tried teaching me when I was a kid, to no avail. Neither of us had the patience for it). I listen to a wide variety of music, from Bach to Marilyn Manson. One exception - not so fussed on the Country stuff. I enjoy complex music (alternative stuff, classical is good for this) but also like the simple rhythms and patterns in music that may only use a couple of instruments.I taught myself how to play guitar. And by that I mean I wanted to play along with some of the music I listen to, so taught myself a few basic chords and started adding more as I went along. I can't read music (and certainly can't compose anything) - I get about 3rd line down the stave and can't figure it out any more, becomes a bit of a blur and that's just basic stuff. I don't know any chord progressions or what notes make up the chords I am playing or any such theory stuff. Basically, what I am doing is an extension of air guitar, just using a real guitar. I do it as a form of relaxation, unwinding. I enjoy the dexterity required to play/change chords. Haven't got as far as doing Spanish-type stuff - that would require some formal teaching I think, and more time spent on it.I also used to mountain bike (not so much in the last few years what with one thing and another). I ride a motorbike as well, mostly commuting but it's fun as well. Nothing like an adrenaline rush when somebody pulls out in front of you without looking - no such thing as fender benders on bikes! :w00t:Thu, 15 May 2008 14:45:28 GMTThe CosmicTricksterhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI own a bass guitar, and on occasion I use it to produce various sounds, but to say that I [i]play[/i] it would require a serious re-definition of the verb. I can read simple music, and conceptually I can map those notes to their fingering, but in practice I've never been able to put those two activities together successfully. Most of my Mom's family are musicians, but not a single one of my Dad's family is. Odd, that.I also used to ride a motorcycle, but after buying my house, I discovered that both time and money to keep the old beast running were in short supply. With fuel prices rising, I've recently considered buying another bike.Thu, 15 May 2008 12:17:53 GMTDave23http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]Matt Miller (5/15/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Phil Factor (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]As you know, Steve, I'm a 60's blues (and folk) guitar player, though now I tend to specialise in playing the Uke. Perhaps I ought to record some backing tracks for your podcasts. I wonder what an electric band of DBAs would sound like? Would they all be good team players or might they be a bunch of prima-donnas? Would they sing from the same song-sheet? Would they stick to the standards?[/quote]I don't know how that will work. They'd all be looking for the fastest way to play the song....:)"Hey - let's play this in a set-based fashion. I bet you we can get through Highway to Heaven in 5.7 secs that way...."[/quote]Seriously LOL!!!! (Instead of RBAR, it becomes NBAN - "Note By Agonizing Note".)Thu, 15 May 2008 11:55:21 GMTGSquaredhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI've played various instruments for 40 years and currently play in a part time band. For me it's a release from the mental focus of writing and debugging code. It's also a social pursuit where coding tends to be a solo activity.The math doesn't come into play for me. Although I have a fair grounding in music theory most of my "composing" comes from playing around with sounds and fingerings and bouncing ideas off of my cohorts.With the exception of using my fingers to create something, they are pretty much diametrically oposite.Thu, 15 May 2008 11:39:30 GMTgary.rumblehttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI have a Bachelor of Music degree. I was told it was one of the reasons I was selected for an Automated Data Processing internship 26 years ago. It was explained to me this way. Computers and music both deal with structured languages. And just as music requires creativity, the computer field does, too. You are sometimes asked to write code to support new technology; find a way to make an application do something that hasn't been done before. That takes a creative person. Almost every application we did back then was innovative since most processes were still done manually.Thu, 15 May 2008 11:22:11 GMTborn2computehttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxInteresting point, I've never thought of it like that. I've been programming for over 15 years, and I've played (and play) a slew of instruments for years as well but I had never connected the two. My stance on programming is also different than that of most people - I prefer to take a creative look at development, which definitely translates to music. Looking around me, my co-workers all have no drive towards music, and argue that development isn't a creative process. Everything in my life has a creative edge to it, so possibly the link between the two is creativity.Then again, maybe we are all just trying to find patterns in life and human behavior to further explain ourselves where explanation isn't really needed.Thu, 15 May 2008 10:19:09 GMTKit Brandnerhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxPeople ask me what it takes to be a developer. I start by telling what it takes to be a programmer.You have to be able to write a set of instructions that someone else can follow with talking to you.You have to be able to read and write in a foreign language, or read and write music.You have to be able to break a problem down into smaller steps toward a solution.This list is not prioritized.I can read and write music notation. I have [b][i][u]ZERO[/u][/i][/b] performance talent. I'm so bad at signing that folks move away from me in church. As far as composition I've been able to come up with [b][i][u]one[/u][/i][/b] chord progression. Not even a melody.I know lots of musicians. I wondered if many of them get a performance boost from [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synesthesia]synaesthesia[/url]. I did my own informal survey and found that the connection does not hold in both directions. Many people with synaesthesia are great musicians. Great musicians are not always synesthetes.Thu, 15 May 2008 10:06:53 GMTCharles Kincaidhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI agree IT guys loves music and games. I know a top Indian musician used to be a IT guy with Oracle once upon a time. ..........Thu, 15 May 2008 09:58:42 GMTAnipaulhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]Miles Neale (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]Tin Pin - I recently had major heart surgery and had a few months of recovery. Meds were plentiful and the old brain had a few very hard days. When in rehab one of the old timers asked if I sang or played an instrument. I said that I had and he went on to relate that it was a proven medical fact that if a person wants to recover the maximum recoverable mental capacity that they start playing the instruments again. I did and it worked wonders.Miles..[/quote]Miles, glad to hear you have recovered. I think there is serious relationship between music and how much of one's brain it can exercise. I have read that music is often used in alzheimer therapy:[url]http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0ISW/is_2001_April/ai_72297149[/url]Thu, 15 May 2008 09:40:43 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI play guitar and bass. We also have a high number of musicians in our department. not so much on the server/admin side as the programming side. This also hold true in my family. about half my family plays at least 1 instrument, and every one of them is also in IT. Of the ones that do not play instruments, none of them work in IT.Thu, 15 May 2008 09:32:04 GMTAdam Angelinihttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI was born a musician; I began playing my grandfather's piano when I was three, plunking out simple tunes by ear. At seven I started lessons, in fifth grade I started flute in school band (yes I was a band geek). Both these activities continued on into college and grad school, where I was accepted into the musicology program at a very highly ranked music school. I was attracted to pianos ever since I can remember, and later on in grad school, I asked fellow pianists from all over the world if they also had that early attraction and they all said yes. I went on to get a BS in CS so I could earn a decent living and it wasn't until I went to interviews, that HR people started asking me about the connection between music and programming, which I was unaware of. After 30 years in the business, I've had many coworkers who were also very good amateur musicians. I believe there is a connection between musical talent and the ability to see things in organized patterns and sequences, because that's what music and programs are: patterns, sequences and repetition. (I was a whiz a music theory, as many pianists are.) In my case, I have always said I am a musician and writer who earns her living in high tech.Thu, 15 May 2008 09:31:45 GMTdlwashbuhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]stuart.saker (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]However as a scientist I would say, do not make statements without proof. [/quote]That's why this topic was posted as an editorial, and not as an article :D My comments were made based on personal observations and were posted here to get a response from a large concentration of IT professionals. On that note (no pun intended), your response was also solicited and appreciated. =)Thu, 15 May 2008 09:30:14 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxTin Pin - I recently had major heart surgery and had a few months of recovery. Meds were plentiful and the old brain had a few very hard days. When in rehab one of the old timers asked if I sang or played an instrument. I said that I had and he went on to relate that it was a proven medical fact that if a person wants to recover the maximum recoverable mental capacity that they start playing the instruments again. I did and it worked wonders.Miles..Thu, 15 May 2008 09:29:38 GMTMiles Nealehttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxPlayed the guitar, violin, a little mandolin, dulcimer, piano and a smattering of harmonica. Love music over the years and still do.I wear headphones with music on all day and it helps my productivity.There is a deep mathematical and logical base in music. Harmony is a pleasing mathematical pattern of sound waves, and each human mind has a set of sound patterns that please them. Math and logic are also part of what I do in IT and when it works and operates in harmony it also is pleasing.:)Miles...Thu, 15 May 2008 09:23:34 GMTMiles Nealehttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]Julie Breutzmann (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]I agree that a high percentage of the population here has been involved in music at some point in their lives. But I believe that many of the points mentioned contribute to success in both fields.One local company does like to hire musicians for technical positions. One reason is that trained musicians are accustomed to accepting criticism and even using self-ciriticism to improve on their performance. I also understand that the level of brain activity in playing in a band or orchestra is astounding. One experiment measured this in basketball players. When they tried to do the same for musicians that had to recalibrate their instruments up because it was off the scale for the musicians as compared to basketball players.[/quote]Julie, could you perhaps find the name of that study? I would be extremely interested in it.I found this Oxford study of musicians using FMRI brain scanning which concluded that musicians and non-musicians use different parts of their brains when listening to music, and also that people with perfect pitch have some differences.[url]http://cercor.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/11/8/754[/url]Thu, 15 May 2008 09:23:08 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI am a piano/keyboard player and occasionally play the drums. I use the Roland XP-80, Roland Fantom XR and I have my eyes on the new Roland Fantom G7. My wife and I are the music directors for my church. I have been doing music for over 20 years and IT for over 12 years.Thu, 15 May 2008 09:18:43 GMTloverbeyhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxOh goody, new books to read! On the musical front, I'm a singer/songwriter, and I play clarinet (my first instrument), guitar (classical and 12-string; used to play bass in a jazz band), hammered dulcimer, mandolin, harmonica, penny whistle, and pretty much any other instrument I pick up. Don't really have the lip for flute, but I can still get decent sound out of one.I too would like to see some empirical data - musicians in IT versus in any other profession. I do think there's a connection between math and music, but I don't know if that necessarily translates to musicians being good at IT. I have many musical friends that aren't in IT - even a few making a living with their music! :DOh, and I ride motorcycles too...Thu, 15 May 2008 09:16:41 GMTStephanie J Brownhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]John Reid (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]I would strongly urge anyone interested in pursuing this subject further to read the book [b]"This is your brain on music"[/b] by musician-turned-scientist Daniel Levitin ([url]http://www.yourbrainonmusic.com/[/url]). Although a basic knowledge of music helps, everything is explained and should be easy to follow for non-musicians. The reason I feel it should be of interest to programmers is because it makes you think about the brain's cognitive processes -- and how little we appreciate what happens "under the hood".[/quote]Thanks, John. That one is on my reading list. Another book I plan to read is Oliver Sacks' "Musicophilia" which deals with the same brain/music relationship. Sacks is a fantastic author and scientist.Thu, 15 May 2008 09:02:43 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]Brian Kukowski (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]A great book that talks about this topic is "Godel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid" by Douglas Hofstadter. It's been about a dozen years since I've read it, so can't really quote from it. It discusses three different areas - Math/IT (Kurt Godel) - Graphics (Escher) - Music (Bach)[/quote]Brian, I also love this book, and you're right, it's not a light read. (I only got through 1/3 of it before the algebraic notation got the better of me.)But it is the one book that I intend to finish before I kick the bucket. It's a fascinating treatise on the relationships between math and art.Thu, 15 May 2008 08:59:47 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxHi,We all draw and relate to life from our own experiences. I look upon data structures as molecules with the ability to bond to one or many other molecules. In reading DNA we have to transcribe to mRNA and translate into protein. The thing is that through diversity of vioews a greater experience is gained, so if everyone in your department is a musician you will be missing out on many other worlds/universesThu, 15 May 2008 08:58:08 GMTstuart.sakerhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxBeing 'computer guy' pays the bills. I play mandolin, guitar, bass and bodhran in a Celtic band on the central coast of California. If you want to 'Hear the Darlins' Roar!' and you're in the area, we'll be at the Guadalupe Dune Center today from 4:30 - 6:30. http://www.dunequest.org/Thu, 15 May 2008 08:56:55 GMTAlan Voganhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]GSquared (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]I think this may be a case of "mashed potatoes statistics". Lots of just about any demographic group are musicians, or at least want to be and play at it. Most likely, there isn't a significant connection between the two.At the place I work, the CEO, one department manager, 2 salespeople, an accountant, and someone who has switched departments three times in the last 6 months, have a band and play and practice regularly. No point to this except to point out that people like music, just about universally.Then, of course, there's me. I can't carry a tune in a bag. Tried to learn the clarinet when I was a kid - most people sound better when they're tuning up than I did when playing. :)[/quote]Ultimately, you are right. The only evidence I have, or was able to find, was anecdotal at best. Perhaps we musicians/techies are drawing correlations where none exist... or we are drawing correlations that apply to many other industries outside of our own. However, for myself, I can't help but look at development and music composition in similar ways and use each perspective to inform the other. Perhaps it is just certain kind of knack (like seeing both the trees and the forest) that helps a person excel at music and IT, or any other profession where one needs to do that - like a CEO.Thu, 15 May 2008 08:52:40 GMTTed Manasahttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxI am the exception! I can't listen to music, my mind starts thinking about a programming problem I am having, and the music becomes back ground noise.I can't carry a tune or even remember the words to any songs but, I can picture in my mind code I have written in the past. Thu, 15 May 2008 08:47:54 GMTjim.penningtonhttp://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspx[quote][b]Ted Pin (5/15/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]satz (5/15/2008)[/b][hr]I did not think about this till now but most of the people on the motorcycle forums i visit are all IT guys. I ride with a big group of people from a few forums and i am sure 60-70% of them all ride motorcycles are from IT. I never really thought about this till now.[/quote]Oddly, most of the avid mountain bikers I ride with are IT folks. There just seems to be some kind thread that ties them together. I wonder what it is...[/quote]We just all love [b][i]GADGETS![/i][/b] :DThu, 15 May 2008 08:47:08 GMTJohn Reid-322103http://www.sqlservercentral.com/Forums/Topic499205-263-1.aspxMy Bachelor's degree is in Music Performance and my Master's degree is in Information Systems, so I definitely am able to see a connection between the fields. I remember reading somewhere that musicians sometimes make the best programmers. I think part of it has to do with the ways in which both fields/activities utilize the brain (though I have no research or evidence to back this assertion).Thu, 15 May 2008 08:44:51 GMTjustink